HVLP Questions

[Waymon Campbell]

After my recent visit with Todd Burch and Jim Becker, I have been thinking about HVLP sprayers. Questions abound..

1) Do HVLP sprayers spray lacquer and poly equally well?
2) Having no experience with lacquer, is it as good a protectant as poly?
3) Does anyone spray stains with HVLP?
4) On a limited hobbyist budget, what would be a good HVLP system to consider buying?

Thanks for the input.

[Chris Padilla]

Hi Waymon,

(1) Yes, they do. One thing to be aware of is to get a variety of spray tips with various openings. The heavier the fluid (latex paint, for example) the larger the nozzle you'll need. The thinner the fluid, the smaller the opening you'll need.

(2) Dunno...I'd imagine so.

(3) Yes, I spray stains all the time...works great.

(4) My system is damn expensive (Apollo 1000) but I felt I needed its power to spray latex and it does it admirably. I get very professional results with this sprayer and I think it will last me a long, long time. It is a noisy sucker, however.

If you already have an air compressor, there are plenty of good, cheap-er HVLP conversion guns that you can get. I think Porter Cable came out with a good one that is getting good press (PSH-1) but this one is a gravity-fed.

[Donnie Raines]

Waymon, I started spraying via HVLP system about 2 years ago. I bought a higher end Fuji system(...an ego thing I guess) and love it(spent about 700 bucks). The system that I have heard postive things about is the Rockler house brand system...cost under 200 bucks. I have no "first hand experience" but have spoken with guys that own one and love it.

I have yet to spray poly...just pre-cat lacquer and shellac for top coats....both of which required their own settings on the gun and on the amount of flow....something that practice helps you determine. Also, I have not sprayed stains per say...but I have sprayed water base dye's. I only spray the dye on when finishing a larger item..that way I can ensure a nice even coating(..dont want it to evaporate prior to get the whole thing coated).

I love spraying.......when it is warm out of coarse. This time of year I use all shop blended varnish's and wipe/brush them on.

DonnieR

[Tyler Howell]

Waymon,

Fine Wood Working's latest (April) has a good article on HVLP. I learned a lot.

[Waymon Campbell]

Thanks for the heads up, Tyler.

Chris - What are the disadvantages of gravity fed guns vs suction type?

[Todd Burch]

Waymon, I have used conventional spray guns, reduced pressure guns (HVLP compliant), airless spray guns, and a turbine HVLP.

I started out with a conventional gun spraying autos, a Binks 2001 with a 1 quart siphon cup. It works well, but wastes a lot of material. When material costs $55-$65 a gallon, you can justify an alternative, higher transfer rate applicator pretty fast.

My favorite current gun is a SATA LM-2000 RP (reduced pressure). I think I paid about $180 for it, and then with the hoses, Devilbis 2 quart remote pot, fittings/etc., it was about $390 total. It sprays a lot "softer" than the Binks and much less material is wasted.

I use my airless spray rig for latex and oil based, but with the right tip, it would spray just about anything from dye stains to glue. Pressure is about variable but goes to about 3200 psi. (3 thousand, 200 hundred).

The turbine I used back in '96 was a Croix unit with a Graco gun. Grace has just bought Croix. I did not like it for a couple reasons, the primary reason being that the gun I had was defective (or just plain junk). It has leaky internal seals and would spit paint out. I painted a kitchen with enamel. I did not like the bleeder-style gun, and after painting for 15-20 minutes straight, I had to put the gun down because it was getting too hot. The higher temperature didn't do any favors for the enanel that I was spraying either. With this type of setup, you have to adjust your medium to fit the spray unit, as opposed to adjusting a conventional or reduced pressure to fit the medium. I don't like having to adjust with thinning or thickening while I am shooting.

Turbine HVLPs have come a ways since '96 when I used one (at the time, I paid $900+ for it). There are now 3-stage and 4-stage (the air gets hotter with each stage). There are also non-bleeder guns, which means when you let go of the trigger, air stops coming out. A bleeder gun always has a high volume of air coming out while the turbine is running.

If you are going to consider a turbine HVLP, or any gun/system, tell the store you are considering buying from to demo it for you. If they won't, go to the next store. I buy from EAH Spray systems in Houston.

There are also air-assisted airless rigs too, as there are also air-mix systems. Don't forget the electrostatic sprayers too. With all the technology, it can get pretty confusing pretty quick.

Homestead Finishing, Spray Gun World, and Finish Systems are all good resources to help you evaluate the technology that is best for you. Lots of times I see guys shopping for the 1 gun/system that will shoot everything. I'm not sure it exists. Even with 1 gun, you can have several needle/nozzle sets for a given application.

Also, as mentioned, compressed air requirements vary greatly with the different types of guns. As far as portability, the turbine system is attactive. The airless is great for what it does, but cleaning is a pain, so I don't use it for small jobs. I have 4 guns, and they all get fair use.

Have I confused you more? !

Todd

[Chris Padilla]

I would guess (and I don't know for sure since I don't own a gavity-fed gun) that there might be more space contraints. In other words, you may not be able to get in as small a space.

For my HVLP, I bought an extra small cup to hold the liquids and I can darn near fit it into most areas I need to but I guess that could work for gravity-fed, too.

I am far from an expert here.

[Todd Burch]

Gravity guns are easier and quicker to clean, but your range of motion is limited. Siphon cups give you a little better range of motion, but still suck for inside cabinets. My RP and 1 of my conventionals are both 2 quart remote pots. You can use them upside down and backwards, and you never miss a beat.

[Chris Padilla]

Yep, the remote pots are nice.

Waymon, you'll find that once you settle on a gun, you will need to think ahead a bit for finishing inside a cabinet. Pre-finishing may need to be done to pieces before glue-up/assembly.

[Waymon Campbell]

As always, you guys are a wealth on information.

Todd - I was already confused going in, so you only added a little to it!

Appreciate all the info and now I think I will go check out all the resources you gave.

[Joe Bourbois]

Waymon, you might want to check out the forum on www.homesteadfinishing.com. Lots of information about spraying can be had there, often from Jeff Jewitt himself.

[Jim Becker]

I really like the Wagner HVLP conversion gun...it is of high quality and reasonable price. It also doesn't have the potential heat issues that sometimes crop up with turbines. There is a review of it on my site. The only change I'm going to make to mine is to retrofit with a remote 2 qt cup to make it easier to get inside of cabinets, etc.

[Waymon Campbell]

Well, I pulled the trigger (pun intended) on an HVLP gun today. After reading up, comparing need with budget, and taking a look at all the recommendations from you all, I decided on the Wagner HVLP Conversion Gun. Thanks Jim Becker for the excellent review on your site. It was the clincher. Gun should be here Monday. That sound you hear on Monday will be me typing "How do I" questions.

Thanks again...