Plane learning

[Mike Heidrick]

I would like to learn to use a handplane - I am too dependent on power tools. Finally have some good chisels and now and some equipment to sharpen the tools with and now I want a good plane. Have been reading up on the bronze Lie Nielsen #4 and it looks beautiful. Most places have it for $300. Is that the going rate or is this a purchase I need to rethink based on my plane newbie level. Are these ever sold used? I like nice tools and would want a good one that will last for the long haul. Is this a good one to start off with? I have some other ones that were left to me out in the shop. I will get more info on them tomorrow.

[Mike Cutler]

I would like to learn to use a handplane - I am too dependent on power tools. Finally have some good chisels and now and some equipment to sharpen the tools with and now I want a good plane. Have been reading up on the bronze Lie Nielsen #4 and it looks beautiful. Most places have it for $300. Is that the going rate or is this a purchase I need to rethink based on my plane newbie level. Are these ever sold used? I like nice tools and would want a good one that will last for the long haul. Is this a good one to start off with? I have some other ones that were left to me out in the shop. I will get more info on them tomorrow.

I'll try to answer some of your questions

"Most places have it for $300. Is that the going rate?"
In my experience the LN planes seem to be very close in price between dealers. This may be an arrangement with LN to carry their planes. I've never seen huge price discrepancies. You may want to consider the LN 5, or 5 1/2, Jack Plane, first. A little more of an all 'round plane than the 4.

"is this a purchase I need to rethink based on my plane newbie level?"
Nope. The LN planes are fine planes. Out of the box you may have to adjust the throat, and the blade, but that's it.
I have quite a number of LN planes, and chisels and don't consider myself a handtool expert. A quality product is a quality product. LN's are definitiely quality products.

"Are these ever sold used?"
Yep they're on ebay and craiglist all the time.

"I like nice tools and would want a good one that will last for the long haul. Is this a good one to start off with?"
LN's are excellent planes, no matter what experience level. They'll last more than a lifetime if properly taken care of.

"I have some other ones that were left to me out in the shop."

???? You have LN planes that were left to you? or another maker.?

[Mike Heidrick]

"I have some other ones that were left to me out in the shop."

???? You have LN planes that were left to you? or another maker.?

Older planes and no LN ones. Sorry for that confussion. I may have one decent one in the bunch or so I have been told.

[gary Zimmel]

Mike

Merry Xmas and welcome to the slope.

The LN bronze #4 is a excellent plane. I find though, I use my 4 1/2 a lot more. The quality of all the LN tools is great and it takes just a little honing to get them scary sharp.

My first bench plane was the #4 in bronze and since then have found that they seem to multiply quite quickly.... so be carefull. I bet it won't be to long and you will need a plane till.

If you deside on the #4 get it with a coco tote and knob. (it will look even better)

[David Weaver]

At that price level, I would probably start with a 5 1/2. I started with a LN6, and I would probably start with a 5 1/2 instead - just because smoothing with a #6 can be an issue due to its length - if the stock isn't almost flat before you start. A couple inches fewer in the length would've been nice.

You can basically set it up so that you can smooth and joint with it, and it will be a lot more versatile than a #4.

You're doing what I did - and what others on here suggested - buy a LN plane and use it first, and you will be worlds more satisfied with your older planes because you'll have a gauge of what you can expect from them if they're properly fettled.

I don't use hand tools exclusively, but I sure don't sand much now - it's so much nicer to plane and scrape. So much less dust, and a fantastic shiny surface rather than a scuffed surface.

[Mark Stutz]

Quick, before it's too late, stop all this nonsense about hand planes! There. Don't ever say you weren't warned! Kinda like LAY'S potato chips...ya just can't stop with one!

Lots of debate on this topic...whether to go with new vs. vintage planes, and of course the woodie vs. metal debate. IMO, you won't go wrong with a new LN, or LV, for that matter. You can find them used, but often go for he same or even higher on ebay...lots of forum discussion about that as well.

IMO, the old vs. new debate in large part boils down to 3 factors. Do you have someone nearby, a mentor, that can show you the ropes, hands on? Do you have the time, and knowledge, to play with and tune up a vintage plane? and does the budget support a new plane like a LN. If the 3rd answer is yes, then I would go that route. This will let you know what a plane is capable of right off the bat. As your experience increases, you can take that $5 flea market Stanley from 1925, and make it do the same thing. It's a lot of fun. If someone to show you the ropes, it's even faster.

I'm a visual, hands on learner. If I can see someone do a task, I can pick it up fairly quickly. Reading about it is very laborious for me, so until I had a well tuned plane in hand I really struggled. That is why, to this day, I "blame" Dave Anderson for the growing collection of planes that I have!

Lots of info in the archives...lots of different opinions...go with what suits your situation the best.

Merry Christmas.

Mark

[Eddie Darby]

"Buy the best and forget the rest!"

If you want to do Wood-Working, then go the LN route and you will have the best.

Budget tight? Then save your pennies and wait. In the long run you will be ahead of the game.

If you want to do Metal-Working, then don't buy LN because they are ready to go right out of the box, after a light honing of the blade.
Instead buy a run down EBay special or a flee market deal! Lots of work there to do, and in 10 or 15 years time or so, you get to do it all again, since the metal on these old planes is not as stable as LN planes, and will distort.

[Mike Cutler]

Older planes and no LN ones. Sorry for that confussion. I may have one decent one in the bunch or so I have been told.

Ahh.. For a minute I thought you had a huge stealth gloat going there.

Don't get rid of the old planes. I have a number of flea market specials that I use all the time.
Sometimes a rough cut board may have a hidden nail/staple, piece of metal, or a piece of quartz in it.( Yep, quartz!). Better to find out with a $10.00 plane, than a LN. I usually give the rough cut board the initial work with my "junkers".
Eventually though, you will need to learn to tune a plane. Flea market specials are good practice.

[John Dykes]

The cheapest place that I've seen to get LN planes is www.thebestthings.com. I've never gotten a LN from them. In fact, the only LN I own (iron #4) is from Woodcraft. I did get a type 14 Stanley #7 jointer from them since I was scared of trying my luck at ebay. It was better than I'd hoped for - so I trust them w/ a LN.

Regards,
jbd

[Larry Laffer]

re: learning to use a handplane, get some practice wood that is straight grained and easy to work, like poplar. Try to adjust the blade for the thinnest shaving you can get.

This'll get you started...
http://sawdustmaking.com/Hand%20Planes/hand_planes.htm

[Randal Stevenson]

Let me ask a question for those of you with both LN/LV and pretuned oldies from people like Clint Jones and Rarebear. Would one of those, be just or nearly as good, and cheaper, to both get him started, and allow him to look at what has been done for tuning a similar plane?

[Mark Stutz]

Let me ask a question for those of you with both LN/LV and pretuned oldies from people like Clint Jones and Rarebear. Would one of those, be just or nearly as good, and cheaper, to both get him started, and allow him to look at what has been done for tuning a similar plane?

In my opinion, yes. I think the main thing is to have something that will work for you right away. Less frustration means more time for play, and improvement, and besides, it greases the slope a lot better

Mark

[Chris Gombola]

I second the recommendation for thebestthings.com. They are right around the corner from me and have great prices and service.

The cheapest place that I've seen to get LN planes is www.thebestthings.com. I've never gotten a LN from them. In fact, the only LN I own (iron #4) is from Woodcraft. I did get a type 14 Stanley #7 jointer from them since I was scared of trying my luck at ebay. It was better than I'd hoped for - so I trust them w/ a LN.

Regards,
jbd

[Mike Cutler]

Let me ask a question for those of you with both LN/LV and pretuned oldies from people like Clint Jones and Rarebear. Would one of those, be just or nearly as good, and cheaper, to both get him started, and allow him to look at what has been done for tuning a similar plane?

Randall.
Probably would be a great way to start. The wood doesn't know, or care, the maker of the plane that's working it.
I don't have any "pre-tuned oldies", so to speak. Mine came from flea markets and junk booths at antique stores. A lot of elbow grease and cursing to learn how to make them work again I'll tell ya'.
I appreciate my LN's all the more for learning to rehab and tune flea market "Frankenplanes" (Dave Anderson term).

I had restricted my initial response to LN's, as that was what the OP was asking. Used planes however, are a very viable alternative to buying new.

Craftsman studios is another sourse for LN products. Prices are comparable to The Best things.

http://www.craftsmanstudio.com/html_...enproducts.htm

[Marcus Ward]

I must respectfully disagree with anyone who thinks a LN is going to do a better job than a well tuned vintage stanley. Save your money and buy a refurb'd old stanley and learn to use it. I paid 12$ for my No. 4 1/2. I'll take the 288$ I saved on the LN and spend it on... more tools! I must also disagree that you'll have to fettle them again. Most of the ones I've bought, fettled ages ago by their original owners, are still flat and near perfect. Your mileage may vary but the idea that nothing but a LN will do is just rationalization for purchasing a ridiculously expensive hand tool. If you've got the cash, great, if not, there are cheaper equivalents.