Built-in Bookcase - Feedback needed for first project

[Cam Poole]

Hello. First post here on SWC. What a great resource! I was hoping someone out there would like to give me some input on my first built-in project. I've attached a zipped Skethchup file down below.

My plan is to build the carcass from 3/4" MDF with butt joints and pocket screws. The face frame will be poplar, and the shelves will be 3/4" mdf with poplar edging. I'm going to do sort of a faux panel on the exposed side and I plan on applying a shopmade pencil bead molding (aka this months FWW mag) to the inside of the face frame. I'm going to paint the whole thing white.

This is my first "predominantly displayed" project and I really want to make sure that I get the proportions and design right the first time. I've attached the drawing as well as a couple of photos of the spot where I'd like it to go. I'd be very grateful for any and all feedback that you have, but I do have a couple of specific questions:

1. Do the overall proportions look right? I'm not really locked into a specific width on the case. I probably have a range of a couple of feet to play around with. The ceiling is 8'.
2. Are the widths of the face frame components proportioned correctly?
3. I'd like to add a fixed shelf and horizontal face frame rail so that I have the option of adding doors to the lower portion of the case later. Where should these be placed in order to get the best looking proportions?
4. I'd also like to add a horizontal rail to the side of the case. Where should this go? I'm assuming the answer is related to #3.

Here are some photos:








Thanks!
Cameron

[Paul Girouard]

#1: Hello. First post here on SWC.

Welcome aboard.

#2: My plan is to build the carcass from 3/4" MDF with butt joints and pocket screws. The face frame will be poplar, and the shelves will be 3/4" mdf with poplar edging. I'm going to do sort of a faux panel on the exposed side and I plan on applying a shopmade pencil bead molding (aka this months FWW mag) to the inside of the face frame. I'm going to paint the whole thing white.


Sounds very do able.
#3:

1. Do the overall proportions look right? I'm not really locked into a specific width on the case. I probably have a range of a couple of feet to play around with. The ceiling is 8'.

Your drawing looks good , shelf lenght / width would drive the width overall . If you don't want the center partion AND your shelf get much beyond 30" you'd need to think about doubleing up the shelf to a 1 1/2" thickness for greater / longer span.

As it's drawn looks about right to me , but the shelf length isn't listed IIRC.

1. Are the widths of the face frame components proportioned correctly?

Are they about 1 1/4" to 1 1/2" ? That , IMO , is generally about right for the width your showing .

1. I'd like to add a fixed shelf and horizontal face frame rail so that I have the option of adding doors to the lower portion of the case later. Where should these be placed in order to get the best looking proportions?

That horizontal piece show be a thicker , maybe as much as 3" in width.

1. I'd also like to add a horizontal rail to the side of the case. Where should this go? I'm assuming the answer is related to #3.

About 1/3 of the way up from the bottom , or maybe in line with that window sill if the two numbers are close.
Here are some photos:








Thanks!
Cameron

Odd as I typed this your numbered questions changed there self's all to #1's???

Computers , gotta love um , at least if your like me and don't understand them


Edited to add on the New Yankee Norm did a couple of bookshelfs similar to yours , if you can catch that show you'd get some good insights on yours . Show was on PBS here PNW 29 Dec. 2007.

[Jim Becker]

I agree that it looks generally good and that is a good place for it. Out of curiosity, is there room for a matching unit on the other side of the window?

It does appear that you have a switch or something electrical to relocate if you do the project.

[Paul Girouard]

Moving that switch may be a problem , could you live with just cutting it into the cabinet back and leaving a space in how the books where placed.


Something else to ponder , or look at really.



VG Fir CD storage / stereo unit.

Incorporating different size areas and stretching towards that window, there won't be space enought for a chair and the couch or even a end table , so maybe more shelf storage? Just a thought.

[Cam Poole]

Thanks for the feedback. Here's a wide angle shot of the entire wall that puts it into context a little better. I originally sized the bookcase to have about equal amounts of wall space on either side of the window.

As for the switch, it doesn't actually do anything. I originally put it in for a volume control when I wired the house with speaker wire, but then decided against using the in-room volume controls.

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[Paul Girouard]

That helps a lot. Here's what hit me , make the toe space area sort of match the plinth blocks on the fireplace mantel and incorporate the other details crown , rosette's as well.

I like your "matching" wall space idea as well !

I see a outlet but that's no biggie , you should cut it into the back as outlet , switch's , junction boxes , etc (even if they are not used) need to be accessible.

BTW did you make the mantel? You said you where a beginner didn't you ?

[Jim Becker]

I agree with the design elements that Paul mentions...bring them forward on the new project as that will help to unify the room.

[Paul Girouard]

I agree with the design elements that Paul mentions...bring them forward on the new project as that will help to unify the room.

Ya it'll look Hot ! Eh Norm! Ah, , I mean Jim

[Cam Poole]

That helps a lot. Here's what hit me , make the toe space area sort of match the plinth blocks on the fireplace mantel and incorporate the other details crown , rosette's as well.

BTW did you make the mantel? You said you where a beginner didn't you ?

That's a really good idea! Thanks. I never really stepped back and looked at the room as a whole. And no, the mantel was there when I moved in.

[Jim Becker]

Cam, it really is important when working with built-ins that you try to unify the overall feeling between room features...and sometimes throughout a home. Example: In our addition, the trim work will feature a particular bead design that will carry throughout all the new work. In the adjoining great room (part of the original home structure) we've carried through the railings as they are visible to both areas and I'll also be putting in some new trim work to finish off the older space. While the baseboards (and all the trim) in the new space will be painted white and the trim in the great room will be cherry, that bead detail and trim sizing will repeat itself to unify the two spaces into one home.

What Paul suggests about carrying details from the mantel to the new built-ins is along the same lines...everything "belongs". Very important and it really kicks things up from an "obvious add on" to a "it was meant to be there" look.

[Paul Girouard]

That's a really good idea! Thanks. I never really stepped back and looked at the room as a whole. And no, the mantel was there when I moved in.

That's why I make the big bucks , Norm (Jim) Becker as well I guess

[John von Buelow]

I thought this would be a good place to try SketchUp's PhotoMatch. (It's not for the perspectively challenged!) Anyway, with that and Photoshop here is your model in context. I think (not positive!) it's accurate.

In light of the mantel I could see a bit more width in the verticals and perhaps more "forehead" up top. Lining up shelves and horizontal elements can help with that. I agree with integrating the design into the room.It doesn't have to literally reflect all of the details of the fireplace to work, but capturing some signature elements and proportions will be useful. The balancing of the side spaces is good thinking, --- the open angle of the right side walls may allow a little latitude to get the bookcase as a unit tuned, since the open angle will be visually weighted a little differently in the actual space. Looks like a good project.

vonB

[Paul Girouard]

Nice work John

How about the fixed / divide point Cam talked about lining up with the lower edge of the breast plate on the mantel? The mantel top and window muntin is just a little to high for me.

The wider styles and a beefier head rail below the crown might be nice as well.

I pay attention not to let the depth get so deep that the crown has a issue with the side wall , either die it into the wall with a bit of reveal to the S/R corner , or pull the case out so the crown can lay over the end / face of the wall then return into itself.

[Jim Becker]

John's photo manipulation shows that "something" is lacking in the design when you take into consideration the fireplace as Paul points out. There isn't enough "weight" to the basic shelving design, IMHO.

[Cam Poole]

John, thanks for taking the time to put that together. Very cool!

Man, this feels just like one of my software projects at work. We get to the end of the requirements gathering and design phase and think "hey, maybe we should run a mock-up of this by some experts (you guys) before we build it just to 'validate' the design". We then get some feedback, but only act on some of it because now we're in a time crunch to show progress by some arbitrary deadline (New Year's holiday) . And then - bam - some more great feedback comes in , but now we're locked into a design (face frame is glued and screwed).

I propped up the face frame just to get an idea of what it would look like. Here's what it looks like right now:
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I added the fixed shelf and beefy horizontal face frame element. I'm also planning on taking a cue from the mantel and adding a dentil molding up under the crown. I thought about doing rossettes too, but I'm not really fond of the look. The Vertical face frame stiles will get beefed up by about a half inch in the middle and a 1/4 on the sides when I add the bead molding to the inside of the frame. I think I'll also increase the size of that head rail some by adding some face frame material into the top of the openings.

Here's shot of the dentil molding on the fireplace.


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I also attached an edited sketchup file.


Sorry if this doesn't make much sense - tried typing and watching the Michigan / FL game (aka screaming at my TV) at the same time.