Incra G3472 Ultra 16" vs. ULTRA16SYS 16 - Am I missing something?

[bob hart]

Been kinda thinking about a router table set-up since replacing my Ryobi BT3000 which incorporated a router table (let me know if any interest in it) with a PM66.

While researching options, I ran across these two on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/Incra-ULTRA16S...049360&sr=1-29

and

http://www.amazon.com/Incra-G3472-Ul...050665&sr=1-60

I am having difficulty determining how one is different than the other. The UltraSYS mentions 28" fence and uses the word PRO a few times.

Bob Hart

[JayStPeter]

If you're planning on using it as the primary fence for a general use router table, you probably want to look at one of the systems that include the wonderfence. The positioner is fine, but the fence portion of the standard "ultra" systems is not good for spinning large bits. There are ways around it that can work, but they can compromise the strength of the fence.

Jay

[Tim Marks]

They are the exact same thing, just sold by two different vendors for different prices (one is sold by Grizzly, the other by Amazon).

If you want to buy from Grizzly, then I suggest you give your money directly to Grizzly.com instead of using the Amazon storefront.

But if you want the Incra system, then buy it from Woodpeck.com.

That being said, having owned a 25" LS Ultra with wonderfence system for 3 years, I am not a big fan. Possibly because all the capabilities of the system are above and beyond my abilities.

There are a number of other jigs that do a much better job of cutting dovetails. Crosscutting using an angle jig to hold up the work-piece is chancy at best; it is hard to keep the piece clamped to the angle jig and I think you are better off using a jig where the wood stays flat and you move the router (such as Porter Cable).

I found the leadscrew incremental adjustment system somewhat annoying to fiddle with and a waste of space, and the system is now sitting in a box, unused. I now use a Benchdog Pro Fence on a Benchdog cast iron pro top, which I find much easier to use, because you don't have to fiddle with things to get it to work. And it doesn't hog a huge amount of workspace.

If you want micrometer cut capability, I think that adaption of some sort of Wixey Digital Readout will give your the precision without the need to fiddle around (eg. count number of clicks, remember which way to turn the LS knob, etc.)

[Jason Beam]

That's the first well-thought-out objection to an Incra fence I've ever seen, Tim. I applaud your articulation of your issues with the system.

I have the 25" LS Super System (with wonder fence) as well and have EXACTLY the opposite opinion. I couldn't be happier with the system. I have yet to find it impractical for 99% of my work and I walk up to no other tool in my shop with more confidence because of it. The angle fence took a little getting used to, sure, but it's not chancy for me at all. In fact, unless the board is more than say 24" or really wide, I can't say I've had any trouble, but I will grant you taht it takes a little getting used to.

The tail DOES use up some space, you're absolutely right. Even in my little dinky 8x23 shop, I managed to make it work, though. I kept it "closed" most of the time - fence up as far as I can get it, to minimize the tail hanging off the end of the table. There were only a few occasions that I needed the full travel of it, but am glad it was there. I do think I bought too big and probably would have done fine with the 16" travel over the 25, but now that I have more shop space I'm glad I got the 25.

Your issue with the micro adjust does not hit home for me. Maybe I'm not reading you correctly. When using the templates, I never had to touch the micro adjust knob at all. In fact, I know that doing so would muck me up pretty badly if I did. Maybe I just don't understand the issue you've raised there, but I've never had to count clicks.

Thanks for putting out your thoughts, though. Like I said, I've never seen it put better.


OH - sorry for the hijack. To the OP: Those ARE identical systems - i'm surpised by the ~$75 price difference, though, so maybe i'm missing something???

[Tim Marks]

That's the first well-thought-out objection to an Incra fence I've ever seen, Tim. I applaud your articulation of your issues with the system.

I figured my grouchiness would kind of seep out a bit...

Actually, I didn't abandon the setup until I downsized from a 20x30 basement shop to a 10x20 garage and could no longer afford a separate router table. I actually toyed with the idea of replacing my TS fence with an Incra (since I could use parts of what I already had). Then I suddenly realized that I really did not LIKE the system enough to throw more money into it and I liked the tablesaw fence I had, and just didn't have the space for the tail of the system anymore.

I think that the right angle jig really isn't very well designed, and it is needed when cutting dovetails. It does not hold onto the fence securely, and if it twists or the workpiece twists on the jig, then you can just kiss that section of wood goodbye. I found that it took a decent amount of clamping pressure to prevent the router bits from moving the workpiece, which made the jig awkward to use. And the incra/woodpecker clamps that screw onto the angle jig didn't always work if it was a big piece of wood.

I think an angle jig that rides in the miter slot or that rides on a rail like the Jessem system is a much better solution.