Hollow legs outdoors question...

[David Rose]

No, I didn't run the teenager outside.

The arbor I built for the kid's wedding and wife's flower bed has legs with 3/4" thick walls lockmitered into 3 & 1/4" diameter uprights. Once placed outside it will sit on concrete elevated a little above the ground for drainage. I've taken great pains to keep water from entering the top any place. But I am struggling with whether to "plug" the bottoms of the legs. *If* water gets in, it needs an escape route. If it doesn't get in, I am allowing it access through the bottoms if I leave them open. It can't go anywhere but it could wet down the insides. I probably won't seal the insides of the legs, though I could slosh some paint around in there I guess if it is needed. Either way, I will soak a little of the ends of the legs with epoxy.

I have a nagging feeling that I should just plug the lower ends of the legs and be done with it. Does anyone have an opinion either way?

David

[Steve Clardy]

David. I'm thinking--go ahead and plug the legs, but drill a hole in the plugs for a moisture ESCAPE. Just in case it does get in there.
BTW. Did you ever settle on a trim router? You were shopping some time ago for one.

[Chris Padilla]

I'd leave it open...what better way to keep the wood dry or to allow the wood to dry out if it gets wet! If the wood isn't touching the concrete, you should be in business...no problem. I'd just seal the bottom with paint and "slosh" it up inside as far as it is easy to reach and call it good. If it was touching the ground, I'd consider the epoxy--not touching the ground...just paint it or leave it natural.

[David Rose]

Hi Steve,

I got the PC 310. Quite a little machine! I think of it more as a 1/4" mid sized router than a trimmer. It works great "one handed" though which is really what I was after I think. Sorry I didn't post about that, or did I?

David

David. I'm thinking--go ahead and plug the legs, but drill a hole in the plugs for a moisture ESCAPE. Just in case it does get in there.
BTW. Did you ever settle on a trim router? You were shopping some time ago for one.

[David Rose]

Chris, you have me puzzled. Any way that I go the wood is touching the concrete. Or did I lead to you think something else? How would *you* set it up to not touch the ground (concrete), or would you? I might be able to run the primer or paint all the way through and pour it back out. I just couldn't tell how the actual coverage was this way.

David

I'd leave it open...what better way to keep the wood dry or to allow the wood to dry out if it gets wet! If the wood isn't touching the concrete, you should be in business...no problem. I'd just seal the bottom with paint and "slosh" it up inside as far as it is easy to reach and call it good. If it was touching the ground, I'd consider the epoxy--not touching the ground...just paint it or leave it natural.

[Carl Eyman]

When I was re-constructing an old oyster boat into a pleasure boat, I decided to use beaded tongue and groove vertically for the deck house. Even though it was pressure treated he said don't let the end grain sit on the deck. I laid down a 3/4" x 3/4" piece on the deck well set into caulk. Then I butted the vertical sheathing to that (also with caulk) and it has lasted until now. (14 years) The boat hasn't, but the sheathing has.

[Greg Heppeard]

I'd get some pressure treated lumber made for ground contact and make a small foot to set it on. Then cut a small notch in the bottom of the leg to let moisture seep out. I've seen that done on old concrete porches up north and then all you have to do is replace the foot when it finally rots away (I'm figuring about a hundred years from now}

[David Rose]

Wow! So far I've got four different suggestions from as many people and they all make some sense. Ugh! C'mon guys! Get together on your answers even if you are wrong. I do like the idea that at least one of them should outlive me so whatever happens can be someone else's problem, even if it's the trash man.

David

[Chris Padilla]

Chris, you have me puzzled. Any way that I go the wood is touching the concrete. Or did I lead to you think something else? How would *you* set it up to not touch the ground (concrete), or would you? I might be able to run the primer or paint all the way through and pour it back out. I just couldn't tell how the actual coverage was this way.

David

Once placed outside it will sit on concrete elevated a little above the ground for drainage.

I guess this line why I thought you were raising it above the concrete but I see my confusion now. They make (see HD) metal fence post holders that you insert into fresh concrete. Once cured, you then bolt the fence post to it and it is raised above the concrete and the earth. I think the brand name for these things is Simpson or Stimpson. They make all sorts of joist hangers and metal ties for building homes, decks, and what not. The only thing I don't like, they aren't pretty to look at but they can be painted.

However, since your posts are a custom size, I'm not sure these pre-fab units will work for you. Take a look at them...it may give you some ideas.

The key to this whole adventure to keep the wood as dry as possible. Even if it gets wet occasionally, as long as it can dry out, it will be fine.

Could you insert a metal pole into fresh concrete and then slip your posts over them and then bolt to the pole such that the post is just a bit above the concrete/ground? You will have a bolt or two to paint over but it might work.

[Dave Richards]

David, I think leaving them open at the bottom would be fine if they aren't in contact with the ground/ concrete. Would it be possible to set the legs on something to eliminate the contact? I'm thinking of maybe steel posts. Perhaps a piece of steel pipe with a hole for a cross pin on which the leg would sit.

[David Rose]

Chris and Dave, now *that's* what I like! Two postings coinciding with the exact same idea. I can't get emoticons or much else here to work right now, but there should have been a smile there.

The "elevated on the pipe/post" sounds like an excellent idea. It answered questions I had asked and one that I didn't about anchoring.

Thanks a bunch guys!

David

[Howard Rosenberg]

letting moisture and water do what it's gotta do - because - you'll never keep it out 100%.
I'd recommend finishing the insides of these built up legs AFTER you cover the bottom's endgrainvery liberally with epoxy.
The epoxy covering the bottom's endgrain will prevent moisture wicking up into the wood. The finished insides will repel moisture sufficiently because they won't break down because they're not exposed to the sun.
Should last long enough for your great grandchildren's grandchildren to still be using your piece.
Hope this helps.
Howard

[Chris Padilla]

Chris and Dave, now *that's* what I like! Two postings coinciding with the exact same idea. I can't get emoticons or much else here to work right now, but there should have been a smile there.

The "elevated on the pipe/post" sounds like an excellent idea. It answered questions I had asked and one that I didn't about anchoring.

Thanks a bunch guys!

David

David,

Even better. If you made the top of your posts good and solid, the pole could be made long enough to simply slip the post over it. Done. No bolts, no nothing. This essentially makes the post you created decroative and not even remotely structural. You could always dress up the bottom to give it a finished look. This part will be easy to replace over the years.

This have given me some serious ideas about a fence...thanks for getting the juices flowing!

[Lynn Sonier]

Nice to see you're back with us, Carl. Hope you computer stays healthy!
Lynn

[David Rose]

Howard, you think like I do. It only takes a little more work to make it last much longer. Now if I can find someone who will want the junk I build...

David