Questions about lumber

[Amy Leigh Baker]

I have started the search for hardwood suppliers in my area, and that is when I realized I do not know much about lumber cuts and sizing. I have found the differences between roughsawn and dimensioned, I think. Correct me if I am wrong... Roughsawn has a certain number of faces and edges planed, i.e. S1S, S2S and so forth, until S4S (or dimensioned), meaning all faces and edges are finished.

Am I correct in assuming that a relative newbie with a pretty limited array of tools should stay pretty much with dimensioned lumber? In addition to various fine WW projects, I am also looking at doing new trimwork in a couple of rooms, but I want to do what I would consider a "custom" job, meaning take my time, use stain grade wood such as maple, and go the extra mile to more than just add the basics like window trim and baseboard. There's a ten foot bow window I would like to make custom window sills on top and bottom, plus trim.

What should I be looking for in lumber? What specifications should I ask a supplier for?

Thanks,

Amy

P.S. I have also attached part of a catalog of a distributor near me that sparked these questions.

[Michael Liechty]

Amy if you stay with dimensioned lumber for your built- ins and trim work you will be fine. Most of us buy it that way unless we have the capability of milling it down from larger stock, needing planes, joiners, resaw etc.

ML

[Peter Gregory]

I figure that it takes one third of your time to make the boards straight and square. Before I bought a planer/jointer, I had trouble getting boards that were really square on all four corners. If I was going to buy expensive boards that were S4S, I would have my square with me and checking for 90 degrees. You might consider renting time on a joiner/planer at your local junior college/high school via a class if you don't find the boards you need in the right form. If the boards aren't square, it is hard to make a piece of furniture. If you use plywood or MDF, it solves some of these problems.

Think you will have less trouble with trim. Finish carpenters seem to buy trim, sand, install, finish, and you don't see a planer around on job sites. That bow window sounds like fun, start with something easier.

I started with no skills and it took me a few years of hobby work before I could make a reasonable project. Went though a bunch of books on how to start. I liked Woodworking for the Serious Beginner best. If you like classes and access to equipment, you might try your local junior college's shop.

Good luck, hope this helps.

[Prashun Patel]

Roughsawn is off the saw.
Dimensioned is off the planer

That being said, I wouldn't call dimensioned 'finished'. The sides may have been squared off and the top may be planed to standard thickness, but you still gotta sand out the planer marks and joint the board if yr planning to glue up.

I've noticed finished boards can be burnished or shiny in spots which affects how it takes a finish. So I end up sanding everything again anyway.

But yes, if you don't have a planer, dimensioned is way easier to work with. You can always joint using a router or a tablesaw anyway.

[Amy Leigh Baker]

Dimensioned lumber, huh? That's what I was afraid of. That's going to make the selection go down and the price go up. Not so bad on furniture work, but larger jobs such as trim work it will really eat the paycheck.

I checked with the local community college. They had a woodworking shop class, but recently deleted the courses and therefore the equipment as well. I guess as everyone goes to box stores for finished lumber and there is less need for quality tradesmen, there's less of a need for tradesmen classes.

Thanks!

[Randy Cohen]

try the local high school too.

[Prashun Patel]

Hold the phone.

You can still buy rough sawn and have it planed to the proper thickness commercially. The mill near me charges in 20 min intervals. It's prohibitive on a single piece, but totally cost effective on a larger job - especially if they only have to set up once and then run 50 pcs through at the same dimension.

Jointing is quick and cheap too this way, or you might just set up yr router table (I think u just got one a couple weeks ago, right) to joint yrself.

(Personally, I wouldn't MAKE molding unless you're doing it for fun or someone who really wants to pay. It's way more economical and time-saving to make built-up moldings out of stock parts.)

[Larry Fox]

The way that I understand and interpret the terms is that:

Rough sawn lumber is essentially S0S meaning that it is right off the mill and no sides are flat and straight and that some even still have bark on them. The yard where I buy my stock will plane and stright-line rip it for you but if the board does not see the jointer first it will still be twisted, bowed, cupped, whatever but now it will just be thinner and narrower and, in my opinion, you are worse off.

Dimensioned lumber is *supposed* to be S*S where * is the number of ajacent sides that have seen the jointer / planer / saw. I say supposed to be because it is not always so and I would be uncomfortable relying on it.

You have a few workarounds:

1) Pick up, tune and learn to use a jointing plane (Stanley #7 for example).
2) Hook up with a local woodworker or cabinet shop who will allow you to either use their jointer / planer or who will do it for you.
3) Look in the used market for a jointer / planer.

I am sure there are about a billion ways to do it but these are the ones I am familiar with. Either way, I think you want to get to a place where you can have some control over how flat and square your stock is as having a good starting point makes things a lot easier.

[Lee Schierer]

Amy, I buy all my lumber from a local contractor supply house as F4S dimensioned lumber that is kiln dried and knot free. Yes it costs more than rough sawn, but I didn't have to buy a $1500+ planer and spend hours planing wood to the thickness needed. I get nearly 100% yield from the wood I purchase and in 15+ years, I can recall one piece that pinched the saw blade when I was ripping. I also don't have to deal with bags ad bags of planer shavings. When I buy wood they know me by name and will give me a deal if I buy short pieces as the builders all want the longer stuff. They also sell highly figured boards at the same price as the plain stuff as the builders don't want highly figured wood either. I can fax in an order on Wednesday or Thursday and pick it up on Saturday morning.

Evaluate what your time is worth and do you want to use shop time for making stuff or planing wood?

[Jeff Duncan]

Lee's got the right idea, different uses often require different materials. When I'm building doors, cabinets, furniture, or similar stuff I buy rough sawn as it's significantly cheaper, and I can get thicker/flatter stock than if I have the supplier do it.
Your looking to do trim work though, so getting it from a lumberyard, (ie. not a box store!!!), S4S is probably the way to go. Some suppliers also offer a slightly thicker stock (13/16") with 1 edge ripped which is just a bit cheaper and good for trim.
Doing custom trimwork on a house can be painfully expensive. Most people probably don't realize how much $$$ is spent even on the cheapo box store moldings. Add the cost of using hardwoods and you can spend a small fortune.
I recommend going online and finding a local molding supplier, I have 2 near me that are great. You can see what they have in stock in hardwoods and how much $$$ it will cost you ahead of time. Just do yourself a favor and avoid the box stores, you'll spend way more $$$ for much less quality.
good luck,
JeffD