I will agree with Michael's assessment of considering a used General (or other well made cabinet saw) even without a riving knife. I have used sliders and they are great, especially with sheet goods. But.. they require a large foot-print to get one the size you really need and are very expensive.
I just got a new 5 HP cabinet saw and could have got the Grizzly slider which is actually a nice machine and affordable. But... I dis-agree that a slider makes a cabinet saw "obsolete" as the TS I got (without a riving knife) meets my needs for long board ripping far better than a slider for that task at much less the cost of a slider.
I personally doubt that cabinet saws will ever be obsolete as they have their place just sliders do.
I bought the 650 R 4 months ago after looking at all the options. After looking closely at the powermatic 2000 and the sawstop in person the choice was clear. The General 350/650 w riving knife is the only cabinet saw I would buy today. The seasoned meehanite iron table top and extensions are dead flat and will stay that way. The Baldor motor is superior to the cheap asian motors on the imports. The saw is built to a higher level than the asian saws. No regrets here and I would buy it again in a heart beat.
My shopping for a cabinet saw ended at a local vendor when the sales guy, turned out to be the owner, remarked he was leaving for Bora Bora (or some other Pacific island, I got CRS) for a "sales retreat" with Powermatic to be educated about selling the new "off shore" Powermatic products. Seems they had to compete with Delta's "cost effective" changes.
My 650 may be the last saw manufactured on the North American continent, for me that means in twenty years when I need a part maybe it will be available from the manufacturer, not some subcontractor's replacement.
I also bought the 650R about 5 months ago. I have been very impressed with it. Zero issues with the riving knife and 10" blade so I must have one of the later models. I love the riving knife, the solid construction of the saw, the engine, it's square. I'd buy it again in a heartbeat. I bought my saw through Jesse at Eagle Tools in Los Angeles, www.eagle-tools.com. All the saws are checked before shipping and are shipped like a tank. Jesse comes highly recommended her at MC. To give you an example, I bought my Agana Band saw through Jesse and somehow FedEx got the saw wet but you couldn't tell from the outside of the crate so I signed for it. Of course FedEx said prove it wasn't wet when they picked it up and washed their hands of it. Jesse took the saw back and sent a new one on his dime! I will try to attach some pictures of the 650R in case you haven't seen one.
Last edited by Kevin Davis; 10-31-2008 at 11:52 AM.
This is probably very little help, but I too have been going through the torments of a new cabinet saw purchase. Being an engineer and old codger, I WAY over think and over analyse everything from design, manufacturing quality and about every other aspect you can think of on just about anything I buy.
In reality, when you get to a certain level of equipment, they are all pretty good. You certainly would get a quality piece with a General. North American made and Baldor motors are good. But don't think for a moment that components aren't sourced from overseas. Where do you think Baldor's castings come from in their small motors? IMO any of the top names be it General, Delta, Jet, Powermatic, Sawstop, etc. are going to be pretty good, else they wouldn't be "top names". They all have their niches, plusses and minuses.
I recently went through a buying fiasco where I had to return a saw for refund for various reasons. This sent me on a time eating mission to really crawl around a lot of cabinet saws and inspect their construction, design and quality. Based on that, I can tell you what I wouldn't recommend, but I won't do so publically, because in reality the "lesser" machines are designed for a certain demographic and price point. With that, come trade-offs. Suffice it to say, if it is in the group I named above, its a pretty good bet at top quality. The list is far from all inclusive, as I didn't look into the Euro machines. Nor did I really look closely at the Grizzly G0651 which has been reviewed positively (but so are some that I qould give the thumbs down to) or any other Grizzly model, as finding one to inspect is a bit of a difficulty. I just don't have the time to take a trip to look at one. I just looked at those that I know you can find on about every street corner, as servicability is an issue if there is a problem. I still like to do business face to face when possible as this makes someone I know accountable if there is an issue. That is worth something in my book.
There are some saws out there that seem a bargain. Remember the old adage, "You get what you pay for". This is still and will continue to be true. There is also the adage "Buy cheap, buy twice". Clearly, you understand these realities as you are looking at a General and are not shying away from the price tag. Good for you!
Then there is customer service. How easy are they to get hold of? How knoweldgeable are they? What is their committment level to fixing something? How fast will they do it if a service call is required? I spent some time calling the tech support lines and asking hard questions about complex alignment problems and give them a few scenarios to answer. Two different manufacturer's tech support guys tried to blow smoke. So you certainly would want to explore the service/tech support side of things too, as this is important. If you are going to plop down $3,000, you certainly expect them to step up to the plate and not treat you like a second class citizen because you didn't buy a 10 HP 3PH machine. So I would explore this carefully if I were you.
I hope you have more fun buying than I have had! Best wishes!
Originally Posted by Clisby Clark
I've been agonizing over my upcoming TS purchase and it seems the closer I look at saws, the more undecided I get. Each saw has pros and cons. I'm willing to pay a premium for quality and don't want to have to upgrade after a few years. The General 650 is currently the one I'm watching. I like the Baldor motor and built in NA aspects. The few comments I've read have been favorable. Does anyone have any experience with this saw you can share? Thanks in advance
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Originally Posted by Clisby Clark
