Swimming Pool or No pool?

[Michael Stein]

Personally, I will never have a pool. On the other hand, I do have a boat, and as I said in the boat thread, I keep it at a marina, which also has a pool. We use the marina pool (mainly the kids, 5 & 9) on a weekly basis; at least once, but usually 2/3 times. Accompanied by having the boat on a lift, the combo is well worth the monthly cost for our family.

My parents do have a pool and my father said that the pool (in maintenance/chemicals/electrical service - not including time spent) costs them around $1200/year. They also live in Pittsburgh, PA where the pool is only usable for half the year. For a little less than double that, I "rent" a pool that I don't have to maintain, and I also have a boat lift. No thanks on owning.

[Chris Padilla]

Swimming pools are very nice to have, but if maintaining a small pond (which are generally self-sufficient) is a pain, then you'll not enjoy pool maintenance one bit. Even with a lot of the available cleaning automation, there's still a lot of things to do on a regular basis. If you do choose to proceed with the pool, opt for a salt water system and avoid the chlorine.

Chlorine is key. One gets chlorine from the salt, which is sodium chloride (NaCl). Now I know you know this and I think I know what you mean but dealing with liquid chlorine (sodium hypochlorate...also known as ordinary household bleach) can be a pain but there are automated systems out there for liquid chlorine injection. I use The Liquidator and I love it. One can also use the 'hockey puck' style of chlorine feeding but be careful of building up CYA (cyanuric acid...also known as stabilizer) over time. CYA in the 30-50 ppm range is necessary but if it gets higher than that, the chlorine becomes less and less effective to do its sanitizing job. The only way to get rid of excess CYA is water changes.

Like I said, education is key when it comes to maintaining a swimming pool. It really isn't that hard when you have the tools and the knowledge. The best tool to have is a quality test kit that measures 5 things: pH, chlorine/bromine, total alkalinity, hardness, and cya. With the knowledge of those levels in hand and how they do or do not interact with each other and the levels one should have, one can have crystal clear water to swim in all the time.

For salt water pools, some like them and some don't. The salt in the water may or may not bother you. Also, the salt water generator (SWG) isn't exactly a cheap piece of equipment and it does need maintenance itself and will need replacing over time.

[Greg R Bradley]

Chlorine is key. One gets chlorine from the salt, which is sodium chloride (NaCl). Now I know you know this and I think I know what you mean but dealing with liquid chlorine (sodium hypochlorate...also known as ordinary household bleach) can be a pain but there are automated systems out there for liquid chlorine injection. I use The Liquidator and I love it. One can also use the 'hockey puck' style of chlorine feeding but be careful of building up CYA (cyanuric acid...also known as stabilizer) over time. CYA in the 30-50 ppm range is necessary but if it gets higher than that, the chlorine becomes less and less effective to do its sanitizing job. The only way to get rid of excess CYA is water changes.

Like I said, education is key when it comes to maintaining a swimming pool. It really isn't that hard when you have the tools and the knowledge. The best tool to have is a quality test kit that measures 5 things: pH, chlorine/bromine, total alkalinity, hardness, and cya. With the knowledge of those levels in hand and how they do or do not interact with each other and the levels one should have, one can have crystal clear water to swim in all the time.

For salt water pools, some like them and some don't. The salt in the water may or may not bother you. Also, the salt water generator (SWG) isn't exactly a cheap piece of equipment and it does need maintenance itself and will need replacing over time.

Chris has clearly spent some time on Trouble Free Pools. LOTS of good info there.

Salt Water Pools are great - for the people selling them, and selling the equipment.

SWGs were originally called ECGs, Electrolytic Chlorine Generators - Guess which one sells more equipment.

[Rick Moyer]

You need both: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...5D559AC3C499F1

[Julie Moriarty]

For salt water pools, some like them and some don't. The salt in the water may or may not bother you. Also, the salt water generator (SWG) isn't exactly a cheap piece of equipment and it does need maintenance itself and will need replacing over time.

We were looking at a house in FL that didn't have a pool. I called a pool contractor to see what it would cost to have one put in. He said all the pools they build today are salt water.

[Chris Padilla]

We were looking at a house in FL that didn't have a pool. I called a pool contractor to see what it would cost to have one put in. He said all the pools they build today are salt water.

Well, the pool itself doesn't care if the water has salt in it or not. It is a matter of preference to the pool owner. It is simply a choice of equipment. I could easily switch my liquid chlorine injection to a SWG if I wished. I've read that some people add salt to their pool water even when they did not have a SWG because they liked the feel of it. I would suggest you try out a salt pool and see what you think. I have no idea...never been in a salt water pool save for the ocean, of course.

I think the main thing in Florida with its high water table is to ensure you have pressure relief valves installed around and in the bottom of the pool to ensure you don't ever get a pool pop. It is a rarity around here but my pool refinisher drilled a few holes in the bottom just in case as the pool was emptied for the work to be done.

[Greg R Bradley]

Spend some time going thru "pool school" and the forums on trouble free pools and you will know more than most pool maintenance services and all pool builders. You will have to work to find a decent pool builder at all.

Chlorine sanitizes the pool either way. My pool would require 1000 pounds of NaCl (salt) to be added, then you would use large amounts of electricity to break NaCl into Na and Cl, only to have it recombine into NaCl minus the Cl that evaporates. Every few years you need several hundred dollars worth of new equipment plus labor. Keep draining the pool and refilling to fix the problems in water chemistry. Don't forget that the salt water can't be used to water your yard or go down the storm drains and that you need another 1000 pounds of salt.

My pool was last reflled when I acid washed it after buying the house 18 years ago.

[Chris Padilla]

Greg,

Before deciding to have our plaster redone (to Pebble Sheen) a month ago, the pool water had never been changed since we bought the house in September, 1998. I did my share of pouring (pool store suggested) stuff in my pool before finally figuring things out and going the TFP way.

[Julie Moriarty]

Well, the pool itself doesn't care if the water has salt in it or not. It is a matter of preference to the pool owner. It is simply a choice of equipment. I could easily switch my liquid chlorine injection to a SWG if I wished. I've read that some people add salt to their pool water even when they did not have a SWG because they liked the feel of it. I would suggest you try out a salt pool and see what you think. I have no idea...never been in a salt water pool save for the ocean, of course.

I think the main thing in Florida with its high water table is to ensure you have pressure relief valves installed around and in the bottom of the pool to ensure you don't ever get a pool pop. It is a rarity around here but my pool refinisher drilled a few holes in the bottom just in case as the pool was emptied for the work to be done.

I realize the pool doesn't care but the equipment does. The contractor said his customers prefer salt water because it's easier on the skin. I remember my dad's pure white hair turning silver-blue from swimming in his chlorinated pool. But when the contractor talked about what chlorine does to your skin, I mostly recalled the days when I was on the high school swimming team. My skin smelled like chlorine most of the time, and I could see rings around my eyes for hours after practice.

As for the pros and cons of owning a pool, growing up we had a 20'x40' concrete pool in the back yard. Every spring we'd empty it of its stagnant water and remove garbage cans full of wet, muddy leaves. Then we'd have to clean the whole thing out, patch the concrete around the perimeter where the ice expanded and crushed the sides and then paint it. Waterplug was the only product that didn't require annual repair but my dad said it was too expensive.

On the other end, we initially enjoyed the pool, right after we moved in, but in time the interest waned. We had a diatomaceous earth filter that worked great if you ran it all the time but my dad forbade that because of the electricity costs, so the water was often cloudy. But when he moved to Florida, he bought a house with a pool and it was kept up very well. It was probably easier to afford the maintenance without six hungry mouths to feed. I maintained the first pool but once I joined the swim team, I was so burned out from swim season that I stopped seeing pools as something to enjoy and rarely used it during my high school years. After my dad sold the house, the next owners filled in the pool.

[kevin nee]

I have a 500 gallon HOT TUB 8' x 8' and love it! Very easy to maintain. Minimal problems in 13 years.
if I were to do it over I would get the fiberglass enclosuer, the Redwood that I got is in need of a spruce up.
good luck in whatever direction you go!

[Greg R Bradley]

I realize the pool doesn't care but the equipment does. The contractor said his customers prefer salt water because it's easier on the skin. I remember my dad's pure white hair turning silver-blue from swimming in his chlorinated pool. But when the contractor talked about what chlorine does to your skin, I mostly recalled the days when I was on the high school swimming team. My skin smelled like chlorine most of the time, and I could see rings around my eyes for hours after practice.

Salt water pools are much harder on equipment just like everything near the ocean deteriorates faster.

A very mild salt solution is easier on the eyes. Some people use about 10% the amount of salt that you would use in a salt water pool for this reason. Some people use a mild boric acid solution for the same reason and the fact that it has some other advantages. Mild saline & mild boric acid is making the pool similar to eyewash.

The chlorine effects on poorly managed, particularly public, pools is mostly from chloramines.

The important thing to understand is "chlorine" pools and "salt water" pools are both chlorine pools. You either add the Sodium Hypochlorite from a bottle or generate it by electrolysis. There are advantages to each.

Since the general public has already fallen for the salt water pool "facts", no pool builder is going to spend time talking them out of spending more money. There probably are a few places where salt water pools make more sense which just complicates the issue. When you want simple answers, they will never be accurate.

If we wait 20 years, "everyone" will be removing the ECGs to be safe from Iridium hazards, save electricity, or whatever matches the current trend.

[Chris Padilla]

Excellent points there, Greg.

Folks who are interested in the difference between chlorine and chloramines, click here.

When one can smell 'chlorine' from a pool and one's eyes and nose are being irritated, one is actually smelling and reacting to chloramines. This is a sign to add more chlorine to your pool! You'll learn quite a bit in the link above as it relates to what is known as 'free chlorine' (FC) and 'combined chlorine' (CC--aka chloramines).

Note that I don't have anything against salt water pools. In fact, I strongly considered going that route but as I dug into it, I found the equipment relatively expensive and it does take some electricity and that it was harder on all the equipment in general. I decided to go back to my 'hockey pucks' and liquid chlorine...the old stand-by.

One thing I've learned from TFP is to keep things simple. The simpler, the better. Pool stores and pool companies love to sell you all kinds of things to 'fix' or 'improve' your pool but it comes down to basic water chemistry and those 5 measurable items a good kit will tell you. Once your water is balanced, simply adding bleach (chlorine...sodium hypochlorate) is just about all one needs to do to keep the water clear and comfortable to swim in. Once your water is balanced, you may need to adjust the pH a couple times a month (typically it tends to drift higher over time so adding some acid to bring it down is necessary).

If any problems crop up, usually all one needs to do is add mega-doses of chlorine to ward off the problem. Typical problems are algae blooms and these only happen if you let your chlorine drop too low or to zero but storms and strong winds can blow problems into your pool, too, that might require a chlorine shock. Other problems are stains on your plaster but if you keep an eye on your hardness levels (calcium), those shouldn't be an issue either. Other staining issues can be from high levels of metals in your water (copper, for example) and this is one case where adding something special to your water is needed to combat that (Jack's Magic products...sequestering agents they are called.)

Fun stuff, eh?

[Dennis Aspö]

I heard on the radio only last week that the burning sensation you get in your eyes when you go to the pool is actually an indicator that someone's peed in the pool and the chlorine reacting with the urine in the water is what makes you eyes burn. I guess that's chloramines, then.

[Chris Padilla]

That would be correct, Dennis. The chlorine is doing its job to combat the urine and is being converted into chloramines. This is why one would need to add more chlorine to continue dealing with the issue.

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

Wow, a lot of useful information. But I am not surprise - this is why I like SMC forum.

Ed.