Festool MFT questions

[Darl Bundren]

I'm considering buying an MFT/3 and one of the saws, and I have a couple of questions.

When I set up the table and attached track, will it stay in square once adjusted until I remove it? Or would I have to square it up again if I raised or lowered the height, took the rail off the supports and put it back on, or something like that? The table would primarily be stationary, but I'd use it for long crosscuts and as an assembly table, so the guide rail wouldn't always be on it.

And, will other dogs/clamps/attachments work with the 20mm holes? Any alternatives to the Festool accessories?

Thanks as always, everybody! And happy Friday!

[Roger Jensen]

I have the original version (the 1080). You can raise/lower/remove the saw guide without a problem. There are stops on the front and back guide rail and they always go back to the same place.

On the original version it is tricky if you take off the back rail that is clamped to the top of the table. If you take that off you need to check for squareness when you put it back on. I leave mine on all of the time so it isn't an issue. That may have been fixed on the new version.

I think the holes are pretty standard. I have two Festool clamps for horizontal clamping and I use these Jorgensen clamps for hold downs:



You have to reach under the table to attach them, but it gives you a lot of holding power. You could do the same thing by popping the end off of an Irwin 6" quick clamp and threading it through one of the holes, then reattaching the clamp.

Roger

[Scott Rollins]

I take rarely take off the guide rail (just flip it up and drop the front support below the table), but I take off the fence all the time. I always check for square on my first cut, but have never been off any measureable amount across corners--something mush less than 1/64" over 40" on my MFT3.
It took about an hour or so to set it to perfect square, but I couldn't be happier with it since.

[Dave Lame]

Don't need to worry about a square table. The hole locations are always in the same relationship. And this relationship is quite precise.

Buy 4 Qwas dogs (precision 20mm dogs) and squaring is foolproof. Put 2 dogs in a vertical line and lay down your guide rail against them. Put material to be cut against 2 more dogs in horizontal line and you will have a square cut. No need to worry about the table side profiles, or anything else. Really simple, really accurate.

Optionally, you can buy 2 Qwas rail dogs, insert them in rail, then insert them into 2 vertical holes. Rail will be perfectly aligned. Again, use 2 Qwas dogs in a horizontal row for material.

You can use any brand of 20mm dogs. Qwas dogs are perhaps the best example, and best kown to Festool owners. Festool does not make dogs.

In above, you can reverse "horizontal" and "vertical" and achieve the same square result.

http://www.festooljunkie.com/catalog...ench-dogs.html

Checkout these 2 sites.

http://festoolownersgroup.com/

http://www.talkfestool.com/vb/

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

Qwas dogs work great!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bHVRHrwVNk

Or you can use a speed square. I would caution against buying them through festooljunkie right now. I have had great service from Timmy C. in the past but apparently, he is dealing with a personal crisis right now and there have been some complaints about service logged on the festool forums. You can buy them direct from Steve over on Ebay, just search for "Qwas dogs"

[Dan Karachio]

Hey Darl. This is a big decision and purchase. I have had an MFT/3 and TS75 for about 2 years. I love it, but there are some weaknesses. I'll get to my positives in a bit, but first the negatives.

For working with a full 4x8 sheet what you really need is two mft's or no mft's - meaning you just use the saw on the rail and support the piece on horses or on foam insulation on the floor. This bummed me out. Smaller pieces on the MFT are great, but you need to think about outboard support if you have anything long. If you take the fence off you absolutely have to re square it, BUT it is easy. There is a little play in the MFT at the front end of the rail. The rail comes down on what is really a cheapo little metal tab, but you get used to that too. For power tool work it is great, but no way solid enough for hand tool work (planing or chiseling), but I never expected it to be and have a work bench for that.

I spent some time studying and checking out the EZ Smart power benches and quite honestly I wish Festool had been as clever and versatile. They do a lot of things very well including a lift up rail, never having to re-square and managing large sheets with relative ease as well as very small pieces. However, these things are about $1400 to start (not counting a saw). Still, with what I spent on everything, if I could go back, I might buy an EZ Smart. Still, they are a strange company, small with a cultish following and the product is hard to understand without a lot of study. Not for everyone (too bad).

Positives. On the plus side, the saw I trust most to cut perfectly measured and square repetitive pieces (even 2x2's) is my Festool on the MFT. Way more than just cabinet pieces too. Once you set it up it rocks. I also have a OF 1400 router and have found some pretty cool ways to use it on the MFT.

As an assembly and clamping platform it is absolutely fantastic and super versatile. It seems like every day I find some new way to use it. I have all the Festool clamps including extras, but also use the clamps Roger referred to and other t slot type clamps - it is endless what you can use or do. A super cheap yet must have are these Black and Decker pegs - they fit perfectly.

In summary, while the MFT is not perfect as a cutting platform, especially for large 4x8 sheet breakdown, it is great for making parts for cabinetry and having everything end up perfect. When it comes time to assemble and hold those same pieces it is an absolute wonder. However, with clamps, their router and a vac you can be pushing $2k before you know it. That can buy a LOT of tool for other work, so it is tough. Hope this helps.

[Jim Becker]

My MFT (older version) stays dead-on in alignment.

[Darl Bundren]

Man, the info keeps coming. Thanks, everybody!

I am thinking at length about this as the price tag is fairly daunting--I am a hobbyist, and while my projects are sometimes substantial, I only work sporadically.

Dan, I am pretty much set when it comes to breaking down sheet goods--I have one of Dino's Smart Tables and his guides, and that setup works great for sawing plywood. I liked the idea of the bridge when it first came out a couple of years or so ago, but now that I am more fully interested, the PowerBench at $1400 to $1800 is out of my price range. I thought some about buying some EZ components and building something to put them on, but I'd rather invest my shop time at this point building other projects.

One thing that I do not like about using the EZ setup is that the saw I have is frustrating--sawdust everywhere, hard to keep set to cut perpendicular. It cuts nicely, but every time I use it it seems like I have to fidget with it. It's one of the Dewalt ones with the composite base, which seems kind of flexy in the first place, and then when I clamp down the lever to hold the angle of cut, it often pulls the blade out of alignment. I do like the ability to use cheapo Diablo blades to get exceptional cuts.

Right now, I am most interested in the MFT to do fairly long crosscuts on panels, and for me, it seems easier to put a side of the panel against a fence instead of using the EZ square, clamps, and measuring.

So here I am, on the fence, thinking about tools again. I like my other Festool stuff (though their accessories still make me wince some--$31 vacuum bags, anyone?), and the saws seem like they'd be easy enough to keep set right.

Thanks for the help, everybody. Keep the input coming if you don't mind--it's all been very helpful.

[Dan Karachio]

Darl, I'm going to lay it out here. When I look at my MFT and saw, I really like it for it's design, functionality and overall coolness, but when it comes down to it, I really don't think it was the best value of a purchase for me. Since I bought all that, I have replaced/upgraded my table saw, router table, drill press, bandsaw and orbital sander (a Festool). I have also purchased a jointer, planer and a bunch of hand tools. Everything I have just listed has proven to be more used and more essential than cross cutting with my TS 75 and MFT. Not as cool, not as much wow factor industrial design, but much more useful and productive to making furniture, cabinets and other projects. I did say the MFT was great as a workbench, and it is, but I have a more traditional workbench too. If you took the MFT away, I would be able to manage.

Like many before (and after) I just HAD to have the Festool products. I was joking with someone that they must spray those things with pheromones, they are so darn seductive (same with Lie Nielsen I guess). It is almost a madness that takes over your brain and life - you think about it, read about it, make posts about it, check every review and forum and nothing will cure all this until you just go out and buy it. Only after this did I discover the Festool products that really made a difference (for me). The router is amazing, but their sander + vac is the absolute best. No regrets there, absolutely none, but with the MFT and saw, nagging doubts and some regret.

So, if I had a time machine and all the $ I spent on my hobby related shop, I could easily imagine no MFT and TS 75 and instead a cabinet saw with one of those fantastic sliding cross cutting attachments. For the missing MFT, I would add another shop made bench (with fantastic vices) and maybe a low standing assembly table. Or, I would just buy the darn Kapex and have the best miter saw in the universe.

A TS 55, MFT and just the basic clamps is going to set you at about $1,200 without tax/shipping. Please, I don't want to be too negative or come of sounding like I am telling you what to do, but of about 20k in shop equipment, the only current tools I have that I feel like I really didn't need are the two you are thinking about buying. My pro neighbor with a killer shop and almost every Festool imaginable (both TS saws, MFT, Domino, Kapex, four sanders, two routers and two vacs) tells me for cross cutting and squaring up sheet goods, he is abandoning his MFT and is now going with a sliding table saw attachment on his 5 hp Sawstop (the bum has three table saws!).