Saw Stop cabinet saw tender subject I know

[Greg Pavlov]

...... As I stated in another SS post, I'm still of the opinion that no saw technology replaces common sense and caution in woodworking .........

Sure, and disk brakes and seat belts don't replace common sense and caution in driving....

......and one day there will be a SS accident where the brake does not fire resulting in an injury which casts doubt on the concept.J.R.

I'm sure that one failure to fire will cause some people to doubt the *company* (I have a hard time imagining that anyone at this point doesn't believe that the concept works), but I am pretty sure that there won't be too many. Overall, this company has followed through on what it started extremely well.

[george wilson]

Just before I retired as Master Toolmaker at Colonial Williamsburg,I bought a Saw Stop from the Woodcraft store in Richmond,Va. 45 miles away. I did not have the chance to use it an awful lot,but my replacement person is a new woodworker,and I thought the safety factor worthwhile. I also had to buy the 8" dado set,and the special brake for the dado set. The saw is very particular about getting the blade close enough to the brake pad. Takes some getting used to. The saw seems well made. I had a friend warn me that they had had several brakes shoot unprovoked into the blade. I really think this is because they run a model shop,and have used the saw to cut metal,and mirror plexiglas. The metal conducted body capacitance to the blade,and whamo!!.I also think their cutting of metal with the saw probably left some small metal chips and dust that set the brake off. Brakes are about $80.00 + a new blade. The guy who runs the Woodcraft store,who I know and trust,said they had sold many of the saws without any brake problems. As for longevity of the company? Who Knows?

[Dan Friedrichs]

Bill -

Very good point about the American made cars

Just a thought: Even if the unthinkable happened and SS folded, there have been enough sawstops sold that someone would find it worth their time to manufacture aftermarket replacement brake cartridges. I wouldn't worry about that at all...

[Bill Keehn]

I really think this is because they run a model shop,and have used the saw to cut metal,and mirror plexiglas. The metal conducted body capacitance to the blade,and whamo!!.

George, good point. Conductive debris can definitely cause a trigger. I'd never cut metal on my Sawstop. If I had a need for cutting metal I'd have a second less expensive saw for that purpose.

[M Toupin]

They are already the #1 selling saw

Where did this statistic come from?

I'm having a really hard time believing SS is outselling all other models, especially at their price point.

Mike

[Peter Gregory]

Interesting thread.

I was just thinking, that if SS went out of business and you engaged the saw's stop mechanism and couldn't replace it, it is still a win. I would much rather have a dead saw than a dead finger. If I was worried about the company going under, I would buy an extra mechanism and call it a day. Can you engage it twice in one lifetime? Wouldn't you get really careful after the first time?

Personally, I run a Euro sliding table saw, with splitter, overhead blade guard, and a couple of shop made push sticks. I'm not sure which is safer, my setup of a SS, but they are pretty close IMHO. Can't understand owning a saw without a splitter and saw guard, but I guess Norm does it on camera and I'm not very cool.

Get the safer saw, use a splitter, use a saw guard with dust collection, the finger you save...

[Joe Jensen]

Where did this statistic come from?

I'm having a really hard time believing SS is outselling all other models, especially at their price point.

Mike

Sawstop claims to be the #1 selling cabinet saw on their website home page...joe

[Joe Jensen]

I'm still of the opinion that no saw technology replaces common sense and caution in woodworking.

John, just because a SawStop would replace common sense for you does not mean that it would for everyone else. Further, who other than detractors has stated that a SawStop replaces the need for other safety measures, safe opertating practices, and common sense. Maybe it's just you????

[John Ricci]

Ok guys, I did expect to take some heat over my statement about SS failure and the point I was trying to make was that no one has ever invented a machine of any type or purpose that at some time has not had a failure during whatever unseen circumstance (Houston, we have a problem) regardless of the attention to detail that was taken during the design and manufacture. My worry lies with the feeling that the SS technology could breed a degree of complacency on the part of some users much like a big SUV can give some drivers a false sense of invincibility until that first bad accident. The worst case scenario that comes to mind for me is the smart aleck kid in a school shop setting who deliberately tries to trip the SS brake only to find that he is the first statistic.

At no time was I slamming the product which I too believe is very well made but not immune to that one freak "hey watch this" moment or a real accident situation that could end badly.

J.R.

[Joe Jensen]

Ok guys, I did expect to take some heat over my statement about SS failure and the point I was trying to make was that no one has ever invented a machine of any type or purpose that at some time has not had a failure during whatever unseen circumstance (Houston, we have a problem) regardless of the attention to detail that was taken during the design and manufacture. My worry lies with the feeling that the SS technology could breed a degree of complacency on the part of some users much like a big SUV can give some drivers a false sense of invincibility until that first bad accident. The worst case scenario that comes to mind for me is the smart aleck kid in a school shop setting who deliberately tries to trip the SS brake only to find that he is the first statistic.

At no time was I slamming the product which I too believe is very well made but not immune to that one freak "hey watch this" moment or a real accident situation that could end badly.

J.R.

these are all true

[Don Eddard]

...Two things probably not resolved in my mind is 1 easy scratching cast 2 the motor.

Is a scratched top really an issue on a table saw? As long as we're not talking about the Grand Canyon, I don't see the problem. Yes, it may be indicative of a lower-quality cast iron, but considering the millions of feet of timber that get cut accurately on table saws of all shapes and sizes every year, I would think one could do high-quality work on a top that's less then Meehanite quality. Good cast iron vs. great cast iron is still a pretty close match.

[Joe Chritz]

If you try to make something idiot proof they will just build a better idiot. I am in a position to say this with some degree of confidence.

The SS takes all the major safety features (riving knife mainly) and adds one the is unavailable anywhere else. I don't believe they are idiot proofing the saw, just removing one method of injury that often occurs when people engage their hands before their heads.

Anyone here remember when anti lock brakes first came out. People all over were complaining that they were no good, would fail and all sorts of other problems. Now they are standard and have prevented an uncountable number of accidents and reduced severity of who knows how many more.

Unless you build it yourself you are unlikely to find the perfect set up. Take the pros vs the cons and if the pros win buy it.

Joe

[Tony Scolaro]

Gee folks thanks for all the help. It is true we can live with softer cast. I know I can. But we need to call it like it is. The only question really for me is the motor under production or semi production situation. It would be quite unfortunate to have a saw that couldn't handle it. There is a big difference in a hobby situation and one that can run for a shift like old unisaws and PM 66. I just gave up a saw that could run 3 shifts the Oliver 232 I sold. With no regrets I quickly add. I am going to call an Production outfit in Portland Or. that has three SS and see what I find out. I will report back. I hope they tell me we run them all day long and just love them. Also will go look under the hood again at local tool merchant tomorrow. In the mean time if anyone runs SS all day long in a production situation please chime in with candor. Many, Many thanks Tony

Is a scratched top really an issue on a table saw? As long as we're not talking about the Grand Canyon, I don't see the problem. Yes, it may be indicative of a lower-quality cast iron, but considering the millions of feet of timber that get cut accurately on table saws of all shapes and sizes every year, I would think one could do high-quality work on a top that's less then Meehanite quality. Good cast iron vs. great cast iron is still a pretty close match.

[Denny Rice]

Ok guys, I did expect to take some heat over my statement about SS failure and the point I was trying to make was that no one has ever invented a machine of any type or purpose that at some time has not had a failure during whatever unseen circumstance (Houston, we have a problem) regardless of the attention to detail that was taken during the design and manufacture. My worry lies with the feeling that the SS technology could breed a degree of complacency on the part of some users much like a big SUV can give some drivers a false sense of invincibility until that first bad accident. The worst case scenario that comes to mind for me is the smart aleck kid in a school shop setting who deliberately tries to trip the SS brake only to find that he is the first statistic.

At no time was I slamming the product which I too believe is very well made but not immune to that one freak "hey watch this" moment or a real accident situation that could end badly.

John,
Don't feel bad, I took the same heat from this forum when I made the same comments about the Saw Stop as you did. It seems there are a bunch of guys that feel like your "knocking" on them when you say something negative about Saw Stop, take it with a grain of salt.

[Ken Milhinch]

Here's a slightly different perspective from someone who has never even seen a sawstop saw, and frankly would not buy one even if he could. Schools and commercial shops aside, I just don't get why you part with the extra cash so easily.

I presume each and every one of you sawstop owners have smoke alarms in every room of your house ? If not, why not ? You are far more likely to be injured or even killed by a house fire.

I also presume you and your families travel in cars with stability control and side curtain airbags. If not, why not ? You are far more likely to be injured or killed in an auto accident.

The list goes on, but I am sure you get my point. Of course if you feel that at some time in the future you are going to be stupid enough to plunge your hand into your saw then maybe it's a good investment

[Time to don the fire suit I think]