How to do you make a career out of woodworking?

[Tony Bilello]

I had a custom furniture business. Turns out that the bulk of my income came from cabinet making and furniture restoration. I didn't like either. I wanted to design and build furniture. I sold pieces on a regular basis but if that is all I did , I would have gone under quickly.
People dont really care if its hand made or produced in China. They buy it because they like it. "Hand Crafted" is not really a selling point contrary to popular belief. Most people buy a particular piece because they like it or because it's cheap.
The rare few that make a good living at it are incredible artists. It's kinda like pro sports. What percentage of athletes make it big as compared to all of the wannabe's from High School on up. Maybe one in 10,000?. I dont know it's just a guess. A good amount of custom woodworkers that i know actually building furniture not cabinetry are supported primarily by their spouse's income.
People are paying for an end product and not for your time. If it takes you more than an average 8 hour day to build and finish a table you are losing money. Think what that will cost you in tools. A Stroke sander, edge sander, disk sander, drum saner and a wide belt sander. What about the 2 or 3 table saws?, the big planers, the list goes on.
Some people that piddle from time to time have no idea how long it takes them to make something. When you do it for a living, you find out quickly exactly how long. Oh yea, one more thing, when you are building, who is doing your selling for you, you know, the estimates, the sketches, etc.
Whe you are doing that whop is doing the building? All of this is going on while the rent is still due.
I better stop now, I can go on for ever.
Your are actually competing for dollars not just against other woodworkers. You are competing against a boat, a car downpayment, a ski weekend, a new TV, a gym, a golf course, etc.

[Rick Cicciarelli]

ugh...life sucks. Why is it everything that is cool, and was something someone could have at one time made a living doing...is no longer? The only jobs that one can make a living at are super boring...ugh.... Sick of doing yuck work to pay the bills.....why can't I find something I love to do that will cover expenses??

[Peter Quadarella]

As described, it depends on what the expenses are. Woodworking is a fulfilling activity, therefore there are many people doing it, driving the price down, not to mention the big factory stuff. I've met several woodworkers who make a living at their job.

It's possible, but you have to be willing to live modestly and trade cash and toys for fulfillment. The fact is, boring, annoying, and hellish jobs are ones that people would rather not do, so companies have to pay well to get workers for them.

[Michael O'Sullivan]

ugh...life sucks. Why is it everything that is cool, and was something someone could have at one time made a living doing...is no longer? The only jobs that one can make a living at are super boring...ugh.... Sick of doing yuck work to pay the bills.....why can't I find something I love to do that will cover expenses??

Not to pile on, but as several have pointed out above, just about the only way to make decent money running a WW business is to strip away all the things that make it fun in the first place.

Honestly, I would recommend that rather than starting up your own business, you go to work for a custom cabinet/furniture maker and see what it is like. You can always strike out on your own down the road, and if you pay attention, you should learn a lot about running a small business.

[Joe Jensen]

Not to pile on, but as several have pointed out above, just about the only way to make decent money running a WW business is to strip away all the things that make it fun in the first place.

Honestly, I would recommend that rather than starting up your own business, you go to work for a custom cabinet/furniture maker and see what it is like. You can always strike out on your own down the road, and if you pay attention, you should learn a lot about running a small business.

Fantastis idea. You will learn on someone else's nickel. Plus, you will net more doing that for 6 months than you will for the first 6 months on your own.

More on my comments on the business side. A very high percentage of Doctor's offices fail because doctors want to practice medicine, and the are not trained to do the business side. Same is true for small businesses. When you see successful small businesses they are invariably run by people with sound business skills. The ones that fail are often run by people who have talent and passion around their trade, but they don't have the business skills to keep the business running.

[Gary Herrmann]

ugh...life sucks. Why is it everything that is cool, and was something someone could have at one time made a living doing...is no longer? The only jobs that one can make a living at are super boring...ugh.... Sick of doing yuck work to pay the bills.....why can't I find something I love to do that will cover expenses??

Rick, I agree with Joe - Michael does have a very good idea, but if you have no experience as a pro - that could be tough in this economy as well.

One other way to look at this is - would you still love it if you did it for money 60-80 hours per week? That's the thing I wonder about the most.

[Richard Wolf]

I enjoy a good life making a living at woodworking. Those of you that know me, know that I build stairs and install railings for a living. When home building is in a boom I work in new construction for builders. When things get slow, like now, I do renovations for homeowners. In the northeast, a lot of homes got built with wrought iron rails on interior stairs, and people like to replace them with wood.
It is not the most creative woodworking all the time, but it allows me the ability to have a 1800 sq. ft. shop and most machines to equip it.
It is a skill that I taught myself by doing as much reading and research as I could find. After over 20 years, there is not much I have not done with a staircase.
It is a very small niche that few people try. Homeowners are almost never successful trying to do it themselves. I have installed railings for many finished carpenters. Some of them are better carpenters then I am.
My suggestion is to find a very small, special niche like stairbuilding and become the best you can at it.

Richard

[Ron Bott]

It is a very small niche that few people try.

I think Richard is right on here. IMHO, your success in the craft will result from one of two possibilities:

1. You find a niche, with little or no competition and exploit it.

2. You are able to design and build things others can't. In this instance, the emphasis on design, i.e. artistic, custom one of a kind furniture.

Finally, do your homework and be honest with yourself about your skills, abilities, and current life situation. Don't let anyone ever convince you that you can't do it. If the skills and desire are there, you can.

[Leo Graywacz]

I make a living at woodworking. You need to do what you need to do. It will not be fun. It will be a job. If you think it will be like your hobby life forget about it. This is real life. You need to start out small. Work cheap and get your name out there for doing quality work at a reasonable price. You need to have people skills, business skills and woodworking skills. You don't need a lot of machinery, but you do need some basic machinery and it needs to be of good quality. No Dewalt tablesaw, no Ryobi routers. You need a few pcs of industrial type equipment. Some sort of a UniSaw, a 8" jointer and a 15" planer. You need a place to do your work. A two car garage is about the minimum. You need the space to do the bigger jobs, you need the room for your machines and the stuff you build. You need to have suppliers that can work with you. You need to have a drive that most 9-5 people don't have. If you think your first 5 years are going to be 40 hours you might as well give up before you start. You will need to work for 60-100 hours a week. You will need all the skills you have and be willing to learn more. After about 5-7 years of this you should finally have a customer base built up so you can go in circles with them and add a few new clients on the way. It is not easy, it is not fun. It is work. And that is why you get paid for it. You need to figure out your overhead, your operating costs and what you want to make. You need to price your jobs out accordingly. You need to learn to say no. Don't get bullied into lowering your price. It is better to sit at home watching TV than to get a job that you will make no money on. At the beginning it is very hard to know what to charge. You will make mistakes, you will make $3.15 an hour on some projects. Yo will learn from the school of hard knocks. If you learn,you will succeed, if you don't you will perish into the night. This is a great resource here. Ask questions. Try not to ask pricing questions because we cannot possible know what your situation is. The best teacher is to screw up. You won't do that again. I have been working wood for 20 years. I have been a independent contractor for 13 years I have been in business on my own for 11 years. I have never cleared $100K. My best year so far is about $120K GROSS. I live comfortably with my wife and 3 kids in a house that I own, no more mortgage. My wife has a job. This is essential. My pay schedule is very (very) inconsistent. I get large sums of money every once and a while. The wifes consistent paycheck is nice and fills in the gaps. It would be hard to do without it. So think before you jump. Yes, it can be done. But with the economy in the state that it is in currently it is the wrong time to enter this field. But, if you are being forced to leave your position it is the best time to try, you may have little choice. Offer a service that no other does. Be there for your client. The best advertisement you can ever have is word of mouth. Good luck to you.

[Jim Kountz]

My suggestion is to find a very small, special niche like stairbuilding and become the best you can at it.

Richard

Ahh now we're getting somewhere. All this talk about you cant do this and you cant do that and you need 20k a month. Hogwash. What you need is to do one thing, and do it well. Dont just "take on woodworking for cash". Thats crazy. Have a plan and stick to it. Find a need an fill it. They're out there, one just needs to look for them. Look around your everyday lives and you will start to see many opportunities. Building one offs and custom items is a very hard row to hoe, I wouldnt even begin to think I could make a living doing that right now but specialized woodworking, things harry homeowner cant do, theres your huckleberry.

[Doug Miller 303]

Gents,

I will agree with all of the above comments. I only have three schools of thought to add in to the mix.

1. I know a fella that makes antique reproductions for a worldwide firm, and he does alright. He only has one or two customers, and therefore doesn't have to worry about sales and estimating....much. He makes only 10 or 15 different pieces, over and over again. Every few years the pieces change. He works out of a barn that he rents for very little money, and only has the absolutely necessary tools.

2. Extreme specialization. Do something that not many others can do. These specializations will require months to years of study time before you even consider looking at a tape measure. It might also require a few math and/or engineering classes. The first five or ten attempts at building the product will most likely fail, and you will have to pay for it. Finding somebody to buy this product may prove difficult.

3. Location, location, location. Move your shop to that part of the country that requires the least amount of heating and cooling dollars, and the cost of living is still relatively inexpensive. Your customer base can be via the internet nowadays, whilst the product can be shipped anywhere in the world. Or, have a huge showroom in a well traveled, tourist trap area. Hire the best sales men/women you can get. This may mean saying goodbye to old friends and family.

Don't let anybody discourage you from your dream, as anything is possible. It just requires a ton of dedication, blood, sweat and tears.

Good luck,

Doug

[Mark Bolton]

ugh...life sucks. Why is it everything that is cool, and was something someone could have at one time made a living doing...is no longer? The only jobs that one can make a living at are super boring...ugh.... Sick of doing yuck work to pay the bills.....why can't I find something I love to do that will cover expenses??

That last part is the key. While its difficult to get them down once they are up, if they are down or reasonable, your opportunities broaden exponentially.

Again, I keep reading about all these extremes, 20k/month in expenses for a massive production shop and so on. Those things are perfectly fine, we have many friends who have no desire to live in a modest home, drive a modest vehicle, and live an average life. They own their own companies and want "The Donald" life. New vehicles, harley's, boats, trips, sit in the office on the phone, on and on. But as many of them flame out they realize that they wish they had stuck with a smaller operation where they were more a part of the process.

Its easy to get carried away especially when ego and testosterone are stirred in the same pot.

Mark

[John Ricci]

You have to have your "backup" income in most cases to make it work. Doug made some very good points about location and limited product line. I have my ww business out in the barn in a tourist/cottage/ski area and I mainly make red cedar deck furniture, custom kitchen boxes and simple toys. The cottagers buy my chairs and kitchen bits and all of the older folks will spend money on toys for the grandkids long before they spend it on themselves...a throwback to a simpler time and something the kids will hopefully hang onto for their families later. The backup for this is the clincher...we own/operate an antique and vintage housewares store which provides the venue for exposure of our products. I do the woodwork and my wife is a custom sewer who is constantly busy with projects for folks who own $1mil+ "vacation homes" and they don't mind spending money on high quality goods available and made locally. Right now it seems a lot of folks are looking to "the good old days" when making their purchases. In the right customer demographic Made In China just doesn't cut it. It may seem nuts but as the economic situation has worsened, our sales have increased nicely

J.R.

[Paul Johnstone]

ugh...life sucks. Why is it everything that is cool, and was something someone could have at one time made a living doing...is no longer? The only jobs that one can make a living at are super boring...ugh.... Fricken sick of doing $%#@ work to pay the bills.....why can't I find something I love to do that will cover expenses??

I knew a guy that had a dream to open his own petstore, because that was his hobby (breeding and raising reptiles). He eventually leveraged himself enough to do it, but shut down after 3 years, because he said it was worse than his previous job. The point is, once you turn a hobby into a business, it's not likely to be fun anymore.

I think about that on my woodworking. I will make a goof, but I will remember that this piece is just for me so I can fudge it.. Then I think, "If this was for a customer, I'd have to redo the whole thing, what a PITA that would be".

I just can't imagine dealing with customers and doing custom work for them. I imagine some of them are going to be extremely picky and impossible to please. Then you have to deal with the deadbeats that don't want to pay or try to re-negotiate the price after the work is done, etc.

I really don't like my career either, but it's better than runnning my own business BTW, a survey said that 85% of Americans wish they had another career, so you are in good company.

[Russ Sears]

Do you like selling? It's just a guess but I'm imagining that a lot of small "craft" type businesses fail because the proprietor, though s/he might be tremendously skillful, hates the selling aspect of the business.

If you like selling or think you would be good at it, you might stand a better chance of survival. You might even consider getting into sales for a woodworking related company.