Is this a typical Felder/Hammer purchasing experience? (FIXED! Happy Customer now)

[Roger Jensen]

Hi All,

I ordered a Hammer A3-31 JP about five weeks ago. When I placed the order I needed to pay $700 (towards $3100 purchase price), with the balance due when delivered. I paid the $700 with my credit card.

Yesterday I got a letter from Felder telling me I had to send them a personal check immediately for the balance of the payment, even though the equipment was just manufactured in Austria. They are now saying that I cannot pay with credit card, only check.

Is this typical for Felder/Hammer? I know money is money, but I'm not thrilled with paying off the balance before delivery, and I'd rather get triple points on my credit card for this large of a purchase.

Am I unreasonable to want to see the equipment before I send them $2400 and choose my form of payment?

Roger

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

As I recall they didn't want to take my AMEX card. They wanted a bank check or a wire transfer. I thought it was a tad much. Apparently Austrian headquarters keeps the US dealership on a short leash.

[Chris Padilla]

Interesting. Is this a "we're afraid we won't get paid" kind of thing?

I'd tell them, "Fine, give me back my $700 and I'll get a Minimax that will allow me to use a credit card for the whole thing."

[Matt Meiser]

Call them up and tell them you are disputing the CC charges on the original $700 as soon as you get off the phone if they don't stick to the original agreement. Then follow through.

Our credit union will open a dispute over the phone, provided that we've attempted to reach resolution. They follow up with simple paperwork a few days later. I've used it twice, once when a company didn't deliver as promised (I got a refund of overnight shipping charges) and once when a company went out of business (I got a refund on the portion of the undelivered services.) Another time as soon as I threatened to do so, the company suddenly saw things my way, knowing that I would win.

[Roger Jensen]

Turns out the order form I signed said the balance could only be paid by wire transfer or check. They want payment to clear before it is picked up.

If I want to pay by credit card there is a 2.5% additional charge. This wasn't true when they took my credit card for the down payment, but for some reason they charge it when you pay off the balance. If I decided not proceed I forfeit my $700 (after 10 days you can no longer cancel).

So my options are pay by check, pay the credit card fee of 2.5%, or lose the $700. I don't think they're losing any sleep over their customer service policy, so I don't expect to make any progress on this. I'm not dealing with a local merchant for these tools, so I guess I shouldn't expect Woodcraft-type treatment.

Oh well, lesson learned: read the fine print!

Thanks,

Roger

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

My sales guy told me up front. It was like he was used to people complaining about it and headed that one off at the pass.

This was the same sales man who told me NOT to buy a Felder or Hammer Band saw.

Because he had the perspicacity to for tell me about the payment terms, I was not taken by surprise and did not have a negative impression.

It's amazing what small things make for good relations.

That salesman has since moved on to bigger and better.

[Don Abele]

Roger, like Cliff, I was given all those details up front when I purchased my J/P. Though I thought they were a little strange, I didn't mind complying as I was aware of it all up front. As I said though, it is strange that a major company like Felder/Hammer has a policy like this.

Be well,

Doc

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I tried to buy a slot mortiser several years back from Felder, and I finally just cancelled the order, because I did not want to pay with my low limit debit card in multiple transactions. After the cancellation, I was venting to the salesman, and he said "we would have just taken a check". He's no longer with Felder.

Last year though, I bought a much bigger machine, and honestly, it was probably the smoothest transaction of that size that I've been through. I bought the deposit of a fellow Creeker who needed out of his purchase, and added more money to make the deposit. The balance was by check too though, but i would not have done it any other way.

I think Felder makes far more > $10,000 deals then it does deals that are <$5,000. Their system seems set up for the bigger deals. It costs the vendor more than 2.5% to let you use a credit card, so they could be on the hook for some pretty big credit card fees if they didn't use that policy.

I've bought a dozen or so accessories for my combo, and I still get a kick out of when things ship, and show up here. Some things are overnight, literally, some are a month out. They will tell you, but it is not always the items that you'd expect to take a long time to get here that are delayed. It seems like I always have an outstanding balance because of the way that their billing is set up. Nothing gets billed to the card until the product is shipped, but you get on the accounts payable list the instant you place the order.

Roger, when your machine gets here, just for fun, find a reason to call tech support. Those guys seriously are the best in the biz. It's a great company to have an ongoing relationship with. Plus, you still get a little of that quirky European company vibe to keep it all interesting.

[Todd Burch]

What I want to know is how you got by with only spending $3K? !!! My check was 7X that when I bought.

There was shipping damage on my J/P. You could almost read the sign that said "do not top load", as it was crushed to smithereens from being top loaded. Felder made it good. Then, I couldn't raise the table without grunting. They sent (flew) a tech guy out to fix it (custom springs and new spring brackets) and set up the machine.

They never did get the height dial right. I ordered US, got metric. I called in, they sent another metric. I called in again, they sent a third metric. The last time I called in was for a refund for the upgrade difference. I did get that, and I've learned to read metric.

[Wes Grass]

"I've learned to read metric"

Might be a blessing. Don't know about the J/P, but the 'inch' elevation dial on my saw reads in increments of .078" per turn. IOW, 2mm. Makes it really difficult ... no, make that impossible ... to keep up with the math in my head as to where I am. Not a big deal, as the digital counter on it reads to .01" increments, which is more than close enough for the height of a saw blade. And the dial is still good for tweaking another 10-20 thou' if needed.

.01" is probably good enough for a planer too, come to think of it. But still hard to ignore the pointer spinning around with a kind of 'where it stops, nobody knows' theme to it.

As for accessories, I've had a bunch of stuff show up a week after ordering, recently, that was listed as 'out of stock, xx-xx weeks' on the website. So probably best to call them and ask if it's something you need quick.

I was also advised to look at Laguna bandsaws by a Felder rep, as he admitted they have a much better selection. The Felder that had the resaw height I wanted was too tall to fit in my garage, and only available in 3 phase to boot. And the paint didn't match the other machines anyway ;-)

[Roger Jensen]

Thanks for everyone's feedback.

As a couple of folks have mentioned, this is more an issue of setting the right expectation than bad performance. Had the salesman made this clear it wouldn't have been a source of frustration. Getting an unexpected letter in the mail requesting immediate payment by check or wire transfer when the equipment is still sitting in Austria doesn't make a great impression.

I hope my equipment shows up in better shape than some of the other posters! I'll let you know.

Thanks again,

Roger

[Rick Fisher]

I ordered from Felder last year. It was painless. They where great to deal with. Since that time, I have gone to two open houses with Felder tech's present, and actually learned how to use the machine..

I have to say.. I had some problems .. mostly due to not reading the owners manual, which looks like a small encyclopedia.. I still havent read it..

The Tech guy answered and explained my problems so fast and accruate that I felt like I was dealing with the designer. This guy really .. really knew his stuff. It was bizarre..

They dont accept credit cards on big purchases.. I am in business and agree with them on that point. They also dont do well with cash..
This isnt your local Borg.. they sell specialty stuff..

Anyhow.. I cant say enough good things about them. I was in the showroom again today looking at a Jointer.. Felder is like Festool.. a disease you catch.. Once you own one.. your doomed.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Felder is like Festool.. a disease you catch.. Once you own one.. your doomed.

How right that is! I'm trying desperately to justify an AD921 lately... Oh, then there is that Forka 200...


Danged glossy catalogs, just glad there is no showroom close.

[Roger Jensen]

OK - I give up. What do you DO with a dowel boring machine? You are now officially out of my league...

[Rick Fisher]

I am betting he meant AD 951, which is a jointer/ planer which looks like an aircraft carrier.

It could be the Dowel boring thing...