What do you use for glue joints?

[Art Davis]

I just received my copy of Fine Woodworking for February and finished reading the article by Bob Van Dyke in the "Fundamentals" section on "Creating an attractive tabletop."

I am even more confused now than ever, and am hoping you can help.

I've always used the jointer to get one true edge (that I thought was true, anyway) and one true face on each piece. I then used the table saw to rip the opposite edge.

Now here is what Van Dyke says about what to do after glueup:

"At this point, the top is still a little bigger than its finished size. To get to the final width, first re-joint one edge using a handplane or the jointer. Rip the top to width on the tablesaw and then joint or handplane the ripped edges to smooth them."

Doesn't this call into question the accuracy of using the tablesaw to rip a glue-line? And here I've invested in some pretty good blades to do that.

A bit further on, Van Dyke seems to contradict himself:

"If you used a jointer to prep the edges before the glue-up, cut off at least 1 in. from each end of the top. Doing so removes any snipe from the jointer that can weaken the very end of the glue joint."

Now earlier he has told me to rejoint both edges to true them up, now he tells me that snipe causes difficulties with the glue joints. If so, why doesn't the snipe occur on the finished tabletop?

So, my question: should I rely on the jointer for a true edge or should I trust my trusty table saw?

Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

[doug faist]

Just the first of what I'm sure will be lots of comments.

My practice is to true one edge on the jointer and then rip a glue edge on the other. Works for me 95% of the time. In the instances where it's not quite perfect my trusty jointer plane takes care of any imperfections.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Doug

[David DeCristoforo]

I have been gluing up panels right off the saw for years. As long as you have a decent blade that makes a clean cut and your stock is straight, you should not need to get much more involved.

[Stephen Edwards]

I have been gluing up panels right off the saw for years. As long as you have a decent blade that makes a clean cut and your stock is straight, you should not need to get much more involved.

+1 for what he said. For years I would joint both edges on the joiner, even if it didn't need it. I certain that I got into that habit before I learned about high quality TS blades. Even after buying and using a high quality blade (Freud) that produces a glue line rip I was still in the habit of jointing that second cut.

After reading here on SMC about people not jointing the second rip of a board, I decided to give it a try. Guess what? Like David said, it works!

I do like the idea, and follow the practice now, of cutting an inch or two off each end before glue up, just in case there's any snipe on the ends.

Of course, one still leaves the glued up panel long enough to trim to final dimensions.

[Peter Quinn]

Read closely what Bob has written. You glue up the top, then rejoint one edge, rip to width, rejoint the ripped edge TO SMOOTH IT. That is, you are creating a surface that is easier to sand than a ripped edge. This makes perfect sense to me, and not just because I have taken classes with Bob at his school. Sounds like he is saying glue it up a little fat and clean up those show edges at the end. Leave yourself a little room for the uncertainties that wood contains.

Further, I have glued up large tops and counters using boards that were each jointed and ripped parallel after being flattened and planed, and to my amazement, the top was slightly tapered edge to edge over its length. Go figure? So Bob's method gives you one last chance to get those two edges parallel and smooth after glue up. Makes sense to me, but I haven't read the actual article yet.

OK, so I have read the article now, and everything I wrote above still makes sense to me. He is not talking about glue line rips or not, you are well past that point in the third instillation of this series. I believe if you check the first two articles in the series he suggested using sprung joints made with a hand plane. He is a big proponent of using hand planes. Either way how you choose to prepare boards for glue up is beside the point of this part of the article.

[Rich Neighbarger]

Yes, yes, yes, and yes. +1 to all above.

[Glen Butler]

He said "removes snipe cause by the jointer"??? I have heard of snipe on a planer which has happened to me on occasion. But snipe on a jointer. Never. I don't see it is even possible. On a planer the wood can get closer to the cutter because the pressure wheels. On a jointer, the metal bed just can't move.

Glue line rips are easily attainable on a table saw but it is absolutely important that the blade is running as perfect to parallel to the fence as it can be. You can rely on either for perfect joints as long as they are setup correctly.

What blade do others use for their glue line rips?

[Steve Mellott]

It depends on the quality of my saw cut. Usually there are some minor blade marks and I use the jointer to clean up the edge. Not sure if it is needed or not, but it gives me piece of mind and doesn't require much time or effort.

Steve

[Myk Rian]

Glue line rips are easily attainable on a table saw but it is absolutely important that the blade is running as perfect to parallel..

Let's make that perpendicular.

What blade do others use for their glue line rips?

Freud glue line rip, on stock up to 1" thick.
I've never seen a need to joint after ripping the stock.

[Steve Jenkins]

If your outfeed table on the jointer is just a hair low you can get a straight joint but when the stock leaves the infeed table it will drop down and cause a bit of snipe. It is just a couple thousandths but can create problems. It's easy enough to prevent though.

[Chuck Isaacson]

Glue line rips are easily attainable on a table saw but it is absolutely important that the blade is running as perfect to parallel to the fence as it can be.

Let's make that perpendicular.

Actually he had that right with parallel..

CHuck

[Jim Kountz]

Back in the days before I had a premium saw running good blades I would always joint both edges before glue up but like David and others have said with the proper setup its not necessary usually.

[Glen Butler]

Let's make that perpendicular.

Freud glue line rip, on stock up to 1" thick.
I've never seen a need to joint after ripping the stock.

How do you rip would with your blade perpendicular to the fence?

[mike holden]

Art,
There is nothing wrong with gluing up a clean sawcut edge. There are always multiple ways to do anything.
If the method you use works fine for you, then that is all that is necessary.
If you want to learn other methods thats fine too, but if your glue joint gives you a good result, and the glue does not fail, that is all that is necessary.
Mike

[Lee Schierer]

On a well tuned saw you probably don't need a jointer. If your saw leaves burn marks on the edge, glue doesn't stick as well to the charred material. Also the burn is usually slightly indented from the rest of the surface. Like others, I successfully made glue ups with just a sawn edge for years before I acquired a jointer. I still occasionally glue up joints with just a sawn edge. None have ever failed that I am aware of.

If your jointer is set properly there isn't any snipe. Snipe is common with many planers and can be a problem in surface appearance and face joint gluing.