Fair Competition piece, copyright infringement?

[Curt Harms]

I don't think it matters if you're trying to sell it or not. My company recently had an entry in a local CanStruction event (Google it...it's very cool). This is where you build something out of cans of food and then all the food is donated to a local food bank. So, only for a charity cause. Anyway, we built a likeness of a toy. I won't say the name of the company, but we did receive a cease and desist letter from their corporate attorney and were asked to take it down immediately from the mall it was featured in.
If you enter your chair, you may not be caught. But if you are, your likeness is way too good for it not to be a copyright infringement.

Re the CanStruction situation, you'd have to comply. I would also be inclined to place a sign stating exactly WHY I was required to remove the display. Maybe if overzealous IP holders are seen as being legally correct but having corporate hearts that make Scrooge's look like 24K gold, they will use a little common sense in their enforcement.

[Roger Jensen]

Doesn't the copyright holder have the burden of enforcing the copyright at all times or lose the copyright? I don't think they can pick-and-choose when they decide to enforce it, even for a 'good cause'.

From my perspective, legal issues like this stopped being intuitive a long time ago...

[Bill Edwards(2)]

From my perspective, legal issues like this stopped being intuitive a long time ago...

LOL Yep! Somewhere around 1777 when we started deviating from English common law, or opened our first law school, which ever came first.

[Justin Bukoski]

Have you asked them if you could enter it?

[Don Alexander]

so let me get this straight.................... if the penalty isn't too bad and theres a reasonable chance that nobody will say anything then go ahead and do it even though you know that its definitely wrong?????????

WOW how do you explain that to your kids? whatever happened to not doing something BECAUSE its wrong, not because you are likely to get sued?

i have 1 word for all of you INTEGRITY it really does matter

[James Taglienti]

so let me get this straight.................... if the penalty isn't too bad and theres a reasonable chance that nobody will say anything then go ahead and do it even though you know that its definitely wrong?????????

WOW how do you explain that to your kids? whatever happened to not doing something BECAUSE its wrong, not because you are likely to get sued?

i have 1 word for all of you INTEGRITY it really does matter

I think that INTEGRITY is important and I have a strong desire to do what is good and right, but when it comes to such intricacies as copyrighted images and trademarks etc I really wouldn't have any qualms about providing a child with a pirated or illegally produced image of their favorite cartoon character.

You can't steal bread from a mouth that is already full.

[Don Alexander]

theft is theft regardless of who you steal it from or what it is that you take

[Bill Edwards(2)]

theft is theft regardless of who you steal it from or what it is that you take

You need to jump over to this thread and bash on this guy for awhile:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=153952

[Mark Hulette]

You need to jump over to this thread and bash on this guy for awhile:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=153952

Sorry but seems you are comparing apples to oranges here... the guy in the link isn't entering the Transformer in a competition. If he were, it would be the same but it's not.

There are (almost) no new ideas under the sun so by your comparison, the vast majority of projects we as woodworkers make for our personal use falls under the same issue. Sorry, doesn't fly with me.

[Bill Edwards(2)]

Sorry but seems you are comparing apples to oranges here... the guy in the link isn't entering the Transformer in a competition. If he were, it would be the same but it's not.

There are (almost) no new ideas under the sun so by your comparison, the vast majority of projects we as woodworkers make for our personal use falls under the same issue. Sorry, doesn't fly with me.

I didn't ask you to fly,

I was being sardonic.

Many posters see this as an absolute (it's stealing). If that's so, making a
copyrighted toy is stealing from the company that makes them (which I
don't really believe)

And the gentleman that started this post has already siad, he's taking
all this fine legal "advise" and not entering the chair.

[Andrew Gibson]

Wow I am surprised that this thread is still getting attention. I guess that I should mention that the only reason I was considering entering the Piece in the fair is because I had several people in my woodworking club and elsewhere encourage me to do so.
I would not have considered this chair competition worthy.
That being said the chair was made for family the whole copyright issue did not cross my mind until well after the chair was finished. If they want to come after me they need to go after the person who is hosting a non licenced image on the Internet.

[Don Alexander]

just to be clear i was not bashing anyone just voicing my surprise that there seems to be alot of "well yeah its wrong but do it anyway you probably won't get caught or if you do it will likely be a stop doing that type of thing" being expressed here in this thread.

i believe the OP was sincerely asking what he should do in good faith seeking to do the right thing what saddens me is the number of responses expressing the sentiment i put in quotes above

everyone has to live with their own conscience no basing just please think about it and do the right thing and advise others to do the right thing

for several reasons which you all are wise enough to understand

[Keith Christopher]

I have been refraining from replying to this thread and passing along information I got from a copyright lawyer who is sorta of a 'friend' of mine (he had me sign some paperwork when I was published a few years ago). simply because this is a 'hot topic' But it is way out of hand, there is a fine line here, one where you are selling your work based upon the brand. e.g. "hello kitty chair" _vs_ a chair that has a hello kitty applique and upholstery applied to it. Many of the seizures you see on infringement are based upon the premise that the item sold is being sold as a branded item. In the end, it is up to you and your conscience and your impression of your culpability.

[Rick Markham]

I like your chair Andrew! I say skip all the BS and worrying/wondering/ ethics etc. Make something entirely your own, use the inlay skills you have learned, do something spectacular (I know you can) and freakin win! You will feel better about it, won't have to worry, and it will be completely on your merit and craftsmanship. Trust me, you don't need ANY sort of brand recognition... Your work speaks for itself! Just my $.02. Besides by next year we should have no problems turning some killer spindles for whatever you want to do!

[Mark Rakestraw]

Three pages of replies and nobodies been enough of a smart alec to say "the contest is at the State Fair, therefore it's "fair use".