Thoughts on tool quality

[Tom Walz]

I had a very good, private question from a new member. It addressed some things I meant to share anyway.

Unfortunately better quality tools have to be more expensive.

You can take flour and water and make a tortilla or you can take flour and water and make a German chocolate cake. The German chocolate cake will have more ingredients and take more time.

Unfortunately it is not that easy to see with steel and carbide in tools. Better tools typically use better steel. There is common steel which is iron with a little bit of carbon in it. The big use for this is an structural framing for buildings. It is sometimes used in tools where it can make an okay tool. Your better tools will have elements added such as chrome, vanadium, nickel, cobalt, etc. These additives do things like prevent corrosion, make a harder and tougher tool that is less likely to break and will take a great deal longer to wear out.

In the case of Woodpeckers, as with many other really good tools, there is also a great deal of time and care spent in the design and manufacturing process.

Another factor is that it takes really good tools to make really good tools. As an example, you can make tables out of 4 x 4's, 2 x 4’s and a sheet of plywood using nothing but a cheap tape measure and handsaw. You can do it in a hurry and make a pretty good, sturdy, fairly level table. As you get into fancier, nicer tables you will need more and better tools.

There is nothing wrong with buying cheap tools if you are getting started. If you saw my posts on kids toolsets you will see where you got some real bargains on tools for the grandkids for Christmas. These were good tools at really good prices. Their dad replaced his original socket set with a much better socket set and gave his kids the old socket set.

Finally tools, especially handheld tools, are often a matter of individual taste. As an example, there is an old Golden Retriever sleeping on my office floor as I write this. I was raised with Golden Retrievers I like Golden Retrievers. I am aware and will freely admit that there are many other breeds of dogs with virtues superior to mine but I like my dog.

You see this same sort of thing in saw blades. A good carbide tipped saw blade will have several angles on tip. There is an angle on top, there is an angle up and down the face, there is an angle up and down the side, and there is an angle on the side from the face to the back of the tip. There is also a matter of side clearance which is how far the tip sticks out from the edge of the saw plate. All these angles influence how the saw blade cuts. To a large part these determine how fast you can cut, how clean your cuts will be and whether the blade will heat up during cutting or not.

If you're using one brand of saw blade and you'll get to know that saw blade and know how to use it for the best results. If you switch to a different brand of saw blades, even if it is for this is labeled for the same kind of use, you may get different results until you learn to use the new saw blade because they grind angles or the side clearance or something else is different.

Tom

[Van Huskey]

Good points. It is usually the case that you can still BUY quality, go to the top competition and buy their upper level and you will have good tools and tooling. With a hobby like woodworking that is beyond the budget for most (all?) of us here. A basic shop would be well into 6 figures! The key is shopping the middle and lower middle ground for most items and learning where to splurge on the individual upper level item. For me I think the best place to spend extra money is on tooling. An Altendorf won't cut much better than a Harbor Freight saw if there is a horrible blade in it but a well tuned Craftsman contractors saw can leave a surface on plywood like the Altendorf if there is a quality Hi-ATB blade in it.

[Victor Robinson]

Well said, Tom.

How about the axiom "you get what you pay for?" Law of diminishing returns aside, I've found that to be true in every single one of my tool purchases. Could I have gotten nicer tools right off the bat? Maybe, but it would have been hard. It's not that my financial situation changed for the better, it's just that the justifications changed and I began to understand my needs better. That could only happen after I became aware of the limitations of the cheaper tools, and THAT could only happen until after I owned and used the cheaper tools.

[Dave Bower]

The quality of a tool alone will not build a project; they just make the process more enjoyable, easier and faster. Having said that, I simply just don’t like buying or using cheap tools. Not because I’m wealthy enough, (I’m not) but because after many years of working with tools to make a living (mechanic), I’ve learned a hard lesson that cheap tools cost more in the long run.
Add to that, I refuse to shop at places like Harbor Fright. I just refuse to support a company that sells almost 100% Chinese imported junk.

[glenn bradley]

Good info Tom. thanks. I am very much in Van's camp as to where to spend my money. Cutters are one thing I have learned not to go cheap on. My shop has items that are embarrassingly crude yet functional (some are my own creation). These items may never be upgraded as they perform the task required. I also have items that I paid near top dollar for (I have a low priority wish list that gets filled as deals come along) and wouldn't want a lesser item; I'd rather do without. Then there is the bulk of my shop that lands in the middle somewhere. As Tom describes in referring to a cutter, these tools, powered or otherwise, do a better job as I learn their limitations and their strengths and take advantage of them. If my skills or my needs eventually exceed the capabilities of the tool, I upgrade when possible.

[Jerome Hanby]

You may be paying a premium price for Woodpecker quality, but they do a few little things to take a little of the sting off of that outlay. The MDF cases are a nice touch and the color is really nice. Man the stuff is addictive. I think Tom has undone me. He included a Woodpecker catalog in my order and I'm already skipping lunches and going through the sofa cushions trying to fund my new wish list!

[Van Huskey]

You may be paying a premium price for Woodpecker quality, but they do a few little things to take a little of the sting off of that outlay. The MDF cases are a nice touch and the color is really nice. Man the stuff is addictive. I think Tom has undone me. He included a Woodpecker catalog in my order and I'm already skipping lunches and going through the sofa cushions trying to fund my new wish list!

I have always wanted to put a Lee Valley catalog and a Woodpecker catalog in a ring and drop ten $100 bills in the middle! A PETA friendly version of dog fighting.

[Andrew Pitonyak]

Sadly, I missed their Paolini Pocket Rule. Wanted to buy one or two.... <sigh>. I would be beating on their door if I thought that they would have some at the show.

[Jerome Hanby]

maybe it's some weird web page generation thing, but I Googled that and got this link. It indicates that they are shipping Feb 2012. Think I'll see if it will let me order...

Sadly, I missed their Paolini Pocket Rule. Wanted to buy one or two.... <sigh>. I would be beating on their door if I thought that they would have some at the show.

[Bill White]

Though I often think of the axiom, "It ain't the arrow. Its the Indian", I choose to use the equip. and tooling that will yield the best results. I have a mixed bag of power-hand tooling that have been acquired based on function, need, and value. There is (in my mind) no way to spend your way into mastering our craft.
I don't know of any old master woodworker who excelled because of digital micrometeric absolutes (or polyurethane).
Bill

[Jerome Hanby]

TThere is (in my mind) no way to spend your way into mastering our craft.
Bill

But it sure is fun to try!

[Russ D Wood]

I am a hobby woodworker. I am NOT a GOOD woodworker, but I just enjoy the heck out of it! When I retired and built my dream shop I had no idea of what I would end up doing in my shop other that it would be wood related. So my issue was what to get in the way of tools and of what quality just as this thread is reviewing. At that point in time in my hobby the difference between a $200 hand tool and a $50 HF hand tool would have NO impact on the quality of what I was building. In the 4 years since then I have updated some of my HF stuff. I had started out with no preconceived notions about what I could or could not do with any of these tools. On my majors I did buy quality based on forums such as this one. I have a cnc router, cabinet saw, 19 inch bandsaw, etc,. But my buying at HF allowed me to have many tools both hand and powered. It has let me experiment and decide what to use and what I might need to upgrade. I am very slowly getting a little better and as such I have updated a couple of the HF items. Did I waste money by going the HF route, I really don't think so. My bottomline for my hobby was to have some fun in my dream shop. If it ain't fun don't do it and doing it my way has been a ball! Russ

[Rod Sheridan]

The old line that better tools don't make you a better worker is sorta true..................except it's also false.

Think about the first time you tried to build a simple sheet goods cabinet and the pieces weren't square, or even the same sizes. How did the cabinet turn out?

Pretty poorly didn't it?

Now imagine if your next door neighbour had an Altendorf slider in her garage, and she showed you how to cut the pieces out of the sheet of plywood you had.

Would it have looked better? Darn right it would have, and it wouldn't be because you were in a different garage, it would have been because you used a high quality tool that had the capacity and the accuracy instead of a cheap $100 tablesaw.

Now how about chopping a mortise and I give you a cheap $5 chisel that the edge folds over on, or a nice $100 mortise chisel that cuts properly. How would your mortises look then?

Sure, after a lifetime of practise we can make some nice stuff using inferior tools, but that's not true when you're starting out, and as an expert you can make stuff nicer and faster with good tools as well.

I also agree that most start with cheap tools and upgrade them over time, that's exactly what I did, however that's no more valid than deciding you want to get into woodworking and writing your Felder or MiniMax dealer a big cheque and skipping all the upgrades.

Regards, Rod.

[Van Huskey]

Though I often think of the axiom, "It ain't the arrow. Its the Indian", I choose to use the equip. and tooling that will yield the best results. I have a mixed bag of power-hand tooling that have been acquired based on function, need, and value. There is (in my mind) no way to spend your way into mastering our craft.
I don't know of any old master woodworker who excelled because of digital micrometeric absolutes (or polyurethane).
Bill

I don't think anyone can argue you can spend your way into mastery, though someone could look at some of my tools or tooling and think I believe that!

I do think the Indian/Arrow is fatally flawed though I hear it all the time. Give an archer like Brady Ellison poorly balanced, crooked arrows with nasty fletching and I could probably school him with proper equipment. A master will always be better at overcoming or going around the limitations of the tools but there is a point where the tools are poor enough that an average woodworker will produce a better final product with excellent tools than the master will with poor tools.

[Stephen Cherry]

Unfortunately better quality tools have to be more expensive.

Although better tools can be more expensive, I don't think that they need to be. For example, I just looked at the woodpecker lift, and router. It's over 600 dollars without the table or fence. I have an scmi shaper which I paid the same amount of money for, and the fence alone for this machine is heavier than just about any router table setup I have heard of. The lift mechanism is much, much more robust than a woodpecker lift.

For saws, I have a felder K975, which I bought for a little more than a big sawstop ( and later sunk some more money into). But the Felder is much much better, and in my opinion safer. Even my little inca saw (I think about 600 dollars) is vastly better quality than a sawstop. The inca is a gem, and the sawstop is something less. (my opinions) And the inca was much less money than a sawstop, or comparable delta or powermatic saw.

Hand tools. Look around. Stanley no 4 planes are everywhere, and they work great. They really are yardsale items. My favorite plane is an ece primus plane (about 20 bucks), and I like it better than my Lie Nielsen no 4. Good hand tools will come up on craigslist.

It's my opinion that we are now in a golden age of tool availability. Never before have good machines and tools been available for such low prices. Of course, you have to filter out the tools that are not good, but that has always been the case.