Does fuming QSWO downplay or enhance contrast of rays/flecks?

[Tom Frank]

Hello,

I am about to embark on my first of hopefully several projects with QSWO for my living room, and I'm trying to figure out the best way to really make the figure pop. I have been interested in trying the fuming process, so I bought some 28% ammonia and tried a scrap sample. I have two questions.

1. Does fuming downplay the contrast between the grain and the rays/flecks of QSWO? I can't find the definitive answer to this. My trial looks like it does mute the figure, or in other words everything is equally darkened in a dull way.

2. The color of the fumed white oak looks a greyish brown, like an black walnut sort of umber hue but not quite as dark from a 24 hour fuming. I was hoping for something warmer, but it's more of a cool tone in my opinion. Does this seem accurate or is it perhaps just this one board that turned out this way? I can post a picture if needed.

I am looking for a warm medium brown tone, similar to the warmth and shade of natural cherry. And my goal is for the figure to really pop when the light hits those rays, to where your eye is drawn to it. Is Jeff Jewitt's approach better for this? I read his article and purchased the materials from him, but have not tried them yet. I don't have too much scrap to experiment with, since this is my first project with my QSWO and all of my boards are uncut.

Thanks!

Thanks!
Tom

[Kent A Bathurst]

One of the first piweces I did with QSWO was fumed - a TV stand that is maybe 32" x 16" x 18" tall.

I don't remember the details, but I think that I left it in the fuming tent for ~ 6 hours. The result was a very nice, warm medium brown. And - you are fuming the fibers, so everything gets evenly colored - especially nice for finishing already-assembled pieces. I don't know if you put any varnish on your test piece, but that "grey-ish" tone goes away with the varnish. All-in-all, very nice.

The downside:

1) You are dealing with the ammonia. Full-mask respirator with cartridges designed for the fumes is essential, as are tight-fitting goggles, and mid-forearm gloves. Serious stuff.
2) You gotta build the enclosure. One guy I read, however, would do, say, and entire dining room at once, rent a U-haul truck for a day, and use it for the fuming enclosure.
3) As you suspect, I noticed that the ray flecks do not have the same contrast as the approach I hahve used since - which started out line-for-line from Jeff Jewitt, but which I suspect has wandered a bit over the years - but still fundamentally the same.
EDIT - 4) - most places I have read caution that the wood from different trees will react differently to the fuming. So - build out of one board, or buy a set of boards from the same tree. OR, at least, think it through - like, the top out of one board, and the base out of another - just be smart in the cut schedule.

Done many, many pieces that way. A large % of them have killer-quality wood for the main "show" surfaces - old growth, book-matched - stunning ray fleck patterns. And - I pay very particular attention to the appearance of the show surfaces - which is why, of course, I spend the $$$ on that wood. And - I finish the components before assembly.

The reason the ray flecks "pop" more is that you can get down the base dye coat to the color you want, and then you use a contrasting/darker stain or filler for the field and the pores - you are using two different materials for the two different areas. You can, in fact, go back with a scuff sanding after the stain/filler and lighten the ray flecks a bit if needed, or add a light dye coat if needed - in other words, you can adjust the appearance of the ray flecks as the last step before you start your finishing schedule.

I am glad I did that one piece by fuming. Very interesting and educational. And - now it is out of my system. I would not go that way again, but have zero argument with anyone that prefers that method.

[Scott T Smith]

Tom, it's been my experience that there are better options for popping the ray flect than fuming. If you do fume, I've found that fine sanding after fuming (and before applying finish) helps to pop the rays. Jeff Jewitt's approach is well known, perhaps Scott H or Sheldon will jump in with their advice as well.

I have lots of QSWO scraps that I usually burn to make charcoal for the BBQ pit. If you'll pay the postage, I'll be happy to ship some to you for experimenting with finish. Pls send me an e-mail if you're interested in this.

Regards,

Scott

[jason thigpen]

On a test piece that has been fumed, put a coat of BLO on it. It will get rid of the greyish tone and bring out a rich brown color that really makes the medullary rays pop.

[sheldon pettit]

Pretty good advice here so far, especially the safety concerns!!

Chemical dyes both acids and bases work by reacting with the tannin content of the woods, the look is "permanent" meaning it will not fade over time. The one thing i especially like about Ammonia is that when the reaction is complete there is no need to neutralize anything since the ammonia just gasses off. Kent and Scott T. give sound advice, glad to see it's from expierience and not by reading. As stated, you will not know the true color acheived until you have applied your finish coats to the wood, like dyes or similiar techniques, you never know what you truly have till finished the way you want it to look in the end. Light tints of water dyes can help uniform out lighter boards when nedded, stickley and others doing craftman finishes mainly used amyl acetate and nitro lacquer with the alcohol dyes to blend in lighter boards. Problem with that was the dyes would fade over time. Unless it's a small project[s] that are capable of being made from wood from the same tree, chances are you will need to introduce some tannin of your own, either gull nuts pyrogallic acid or tannic acid, this will help you acheive a better balance of color on mixed woods. 1 oz. to a gallon of distilled water is what i normally used. On the lightest boards the process can be repeated when necessary.


On a secondary note, if your not concerned with authenticity, as also noted, water dyes can give you a similiar look with the additional coloring of the pores with pigment colors since the dyes won't color the harder smoother lignin of the pore walls. Again, there is no one color of craftsman finishes, the range is large as to what you or past companies or individuals came up with, try not to get stuck on a certain color of brown, just do what pleases you unless your asked to copy as close as possible an exisiting piece[s], ok?

Sam/Chemmy

[Sam Murdoch]

On a test piece that has been fumed, put a coat of BLO on it. It will get rid of the greyish tone and bring out a rich brown color that really makes the medullary rays pop.

This has been my experience. I really like the warm brown color of fumed oak and a top coat your favorite finish just makes it better. Kent, Scott and Sheldon make good points too. Still I would not hesitate to fume a project. Did an entire kitchen this way and it was one of my favorite projects results. Sadly I have no photos. Each cabinet went into the plastic tent overnight and then taken apart in manageable pieces to go to the spray booth. Well worth the effort.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Sheldon reminded me of one other point - WO sapwood laughs at ammonia fumes.

Either you eliminate it in your cutting, or you need to use dye to match the fumed heartwood.

[sheldon pettit]

Sheldon reminded me of one other point - WO sapwood laughs at ammonia fumes.

Either you eliminate it in your cutting, or you need to use dye to match the fumed heartwood.

Or, alternatively, you can use the tannic acid and treat the sap with that then apply the fuming, thanks Kent

Sam / Chemmy

[Kent A Bathurst]

Correct again..........somewhere in the back of my brain, I knew that. I had never tried it though.

[Mike Cozad]

What other species do well with the fuming process?

[sheldon pettit]

What other species do well with the fuming process?

Oak/mahogany/walnut/chestnut etc. a good rule of thumb is that darker woods [though not all] will have an increased tannin content, the lighter whiter woods will have little. again you can use tannic acid or pyrogallic acid or gall nuts in solutions of distilled water, [1-4 oz. per gallon] to increase the upper surface wood tannin content on those white woods such as pine/maple/birch/beech/poplar/etc., Since this is only affecting the upper portions of the wood though, it can be sanded through pretty easily, so make sure your wood is ready for finishing where no further sanding is need at least to any extent. In other-words, don't do it with planed woods or coarsely sanded woods unless your doing a rustic wood look to begin with. I personally have only fumed the first mentioned woods and a few white woods [pine/maple/poplar/birch], any others you would have to experiment with to see how much added tannins were needed ok? Secondly, the added tannin will not produce an end product as nice as those natural occuring tannin species will and you will probably need to use a light dye to bring it into a good color match.

[Kent A Bathurst]

Sheldon.....how you have me thinking. Intellectual curiosity, no plans to fume again.

I recently ebonized some QSWO. Came out beautiful. I used two solutions - iron dissolved in white vinegar [in my case, Liberon 0000] and a "tea" made of quebracho bark.

The quebracho bark's addition to the game is it's tannin content. Hence my question:

Have you ever used it for fuming?

[sheldon pettit]

Sheldon.....how you have me thinking. Intellectual curiosity, no plans to fume again.

I recently ebonized some QSWO. Came out beautiful. I used two solutions - iron dissolved in white vinegar [in my case, Liberon 0000] and a "tea" made of quebracho bark.

The quebracho bark's addition to the game is it's tannin content. Hence my question:

Have you ever used it for fuming?

Yes and no - I have used pyrogallic acid which is what it contains [pyrogallinin] , my formulas for ebonizing are many but my main one is a treatment of potassium dichromate and followed by hematoxilin/aka logwood extract. I normally repeat the process twice sand with fine paper [400/600] and then apply a concentrated solution of black water soluble only black synthetic dye twice, when all is said and done, it's as black as the carlsbad caverns with the lights off!!

I have another favorite, but the chemicals can not be had by the home owner, that produces the same affect as the above, but this will get you by if you'd like to try it ok?

SAM / Chemmy

[Kent A Bathurst]

OK - I may have not explained my question well: Have you ever used the quebracho bark as a tannin source for fuming with ammonia?

You are waaaaaay beyond me in the chemistry, BTW.

[sheldon pettit]

Sorry Kent, i have not used the bark directly or any other of the plant bearing tannins except for the ones mentioned, what i was trying unsuccessfully to explain is the pyrogallic acid in the Quebracho or other plants/trees, or the natural tannins in other sources like the oak gull-nuts, can be purchased as a refined product in powder or liquid forms, this is what i almost always use[d] except for running experiments to see if there is any differences enough to warrant using the natural source instead of the tannin bearing chemicals instead. Seldom has that been the case, so i stopped buying the plants/barks/berries/etc., and went to all chemicals instead, back in the early 70"s.