Trotec sales rep and tradeshow pricing... Appreciate input

[John Warren]

So I've been working with my regional sales rep for the last few months.

I've been waiting to order until a trade show came around. I had been planning to drive to the show if necessary even though it was several hours away because of the good deals that are normally available. But he told me I could get the pricing without actually coming. They had a show this weekend, and I even talked to him on the phone on Friday to confirm I would be able to get the pricing without actually coming to the show. He said "absolutely, don't worry about it!" but that he wouldn't be able to email it to me until Monday (today) because his internet wasn't reliable there (not sure why you need a great connection to type/send an email, but that's a whole other issue).


So today, he sends me an email with the pricing info I had asked for (Models ranging from 30W Rayjet 50 to 80W Speedy 300). The prices are anywhere from $3-700 below the pricing he had offered me before.

An 80W Speedy 300 for example is discounted $300 over what he had offered me last month without the show.

I emailed him about it explaining that I was expecting a deeper discount, and he says that the reason it wasn't a very big discount is that he was already offering the best price he possibly could.

But there was no indication to me in our previous conversations that this was the case.

So either I have a really great sales rep who gave me amazing pricing right off the bat without any negotiations at all or something's not right.

I don't want to accuse the rep of anything - I'm honestly not experienced enough to know for sure - but because of that lack of experience combined with it not meeting my expectations, I wanted to check in with the folks here and see what your thoughts are on the situation.


Are sales reps normally able to offer pricing that close to tradeshow pricing?

[Ross Moshinsky]

80W Speedy 300 I believe trade show pricing was right around $25,000-27,000 as of about 9 months ago. I can't recall exactly what the pricing was but it was in that neighborhood.

There is no rule with sales reps. They may give their best price and say "that's the best I can do" or they may say it's their best price because they want the better commission. You're going to have to have to negotiate the deal so that you can live with it.

[Don Corbeil]

Go to the show, and bring your best negotiating skills. Show interest in other laser manufacturers at the show, and let them know that you want their system, but others are also of interest. Keep working it, and let them know you are ready to buy but you need a price that is much better than what they are offering you. At a show you can definitely do better than $700 off the non show price. I went through this last winter, but went to the show and got a much better price than anything that I was quoted before the show. As disagreeable as it is, it is a lot like buying a new car. It's that kind of sales environment.

[Scott Shepherd]

80W Speedy 300 I believe trade show pricing was right around $25,000-27,000 as of about 9 months ago. I can't recall exactly what the pricing was but it was in that neighborhood.

There is no rule with sales reps. They may give their best price and say "that's the best I can do" or they may say it's their best price because they want the better commission. You're going to have to have to negotiate the deal so that you can live with it.

I don't know what show that was, but we didn't pay that for ours 2 1/2 years ago with no show special. I've never seen prices for an 80W in the $27,000 range. They must have known you were kicking the tires.

[John Warren]

Unfortunately actually going to the show isn't an option, because it was this past weekend. He gave me his word ahead of time that he would give me the show price and I wasn't excited about driving 8 hours to get to Houston... Apparently it's a smaller show, so maybe that effects it, but I was still expecting a better price...

I don't know what show that was, but we didn't pay that for ours 2 1/2 years ago with no show special. I've never seen prices for an 80W in the $27,000 range. They must have known you were kicking the tires.

Interestingly enough... the pricing he gave me both before and now with the new "show pricing" is right there around $27k...

[Brian R Cain]

Prices for goods are dependent on all manner of things, not least how well the rep is doing. There was an interesting program on This American Life a while back that looked at the car sales industry. You can get it on their podcast if you want to listen to it. It explained that dealer discounts for cars are based on the meeting of targets for car that a manufacturer expects a dealer to sell in a month. Meet the target and you get a bonus that allows you to stay in business. Fail and it's hard work.

For individual reps, rather than the dealership, their monthly commission might be a percentage of the price of the cars they sold. but for the dealership and the manufacturer, it's all about number of units shifted. You might find that a rep gets a target of selling on average one car per day. He could be good at up-selling customers to high-end models to increase his commission that month, but if the company doesn't meet the manufacturer's target for that month and although he sold more high-end cars than anyone else and be doing well on his commission, if he didn't meet the number of units that went out the door, he could find himself out of a job.

It's all about monthly quotas in the car industry and what you can buy a car for gets reset at the turn of the month. Sales reps will be optimistic at the moment over how many cars they will sell in June so don't expect a bargain if you visit a car store today. Go there an hour before they close on 30 June and they'll sell you a car at less than it costs them if it enables them to meet their target for the month and get the bonus the company needs from the manufacturer.

It's up to you to work out whether similar practices take place in the laser sales industry. I can tell you for a fact that dealers will be asking manufacturers for trade show discounts and get them. Let's face it, there's pretty much the same work that goes in to making a 50W laser tube as a 25W one and never justifies doubling the cost. If your lucky they might offer a deal where the manufacturer offers 25W of power for free since it costs them nothing but might shift a few more systems.

From the dealer's point of view, a trade show is costing him money. He needs to shift so many machines just to be able to afford the cost of the show. Go there on the first day and he'll still be finding out what his competitors are letting machines go for. On the last day he'll know that well enough and be grateful for as many sales as he can get. It's common sense when you understand how the sales industry works.

i have to add a caveat to the above in that not all dealers are sharks. There are some who understand that a good reputation is worth it's weight in gold. A good salesman will know what he's selling inside out and answer any question you have right away, but if he's really good. he'll go on and prove hid answers by demonstration. A jerk who struggle to find where the on switch for the machine is isn't going to do you any favours any more than one who tries to convince you that a cheap Chinese machine with a crappy glass laser could possibly achieve the same standard of work that 40 years of investment in technology beyond where Cheap Chinese machines have got was a waste of money.

[Keith Outten]

John,

Fortunately we have a Trotec representative who belongs to The Creek. You can contact Kristina Jones and hopefully she will be able to assist you in purchasing a laser engraver via the SawMill Creek Discount.

Prices are difficult to share here because of the wide range of options available that can move the cost of any machine in either direction +- thousands of dollars. I do know that over the last few years many of our Members have purchased Trotec Speedy 300 eighty watt machines like mine at lower prices than I paid since Trotec started offering our Members a discount.
.

[Mike Null]

I paid $25,000 for my 45 watt Trotec 8 years ago this week. As I recall a 60 was about 28000 and the 75 was over $30000. I know that I can buy the 80 watt machine today for less than that.

Even paying that much it's still the best equipment purchase I've ever made.

You've got to negotiate laser prices though.

[Scott Shepherd]

Also, before we jump the gun here, let's be clear that we don't know what he quoted. That could have included accessories, cutting tables, Atmos system, etc. Who knows? Without knowing that, it might be easy to say "Sounds high", but he might be including a lot of things we didn't buy.

[Keith Outten]

I believe the rotary attachment is in the neighborhood of $1,800.00 so it can affect a price quote big time.
.

[Ross Moshinsky]

I don't know what show that was, but we didn't pay that for ours 2 1/2 years ago with no show special. I've never seen prices for an 80W in the $27,000 range. They must have known you were kicking the tires.

But you won't post what you paid....

NMB almost 2 years ago it was I believe $23-25k quoted. Last fall it was $25-27k. I can't recall the price because it wasn't that important to me. 60W tube was right around $1000 less. I didn't negotiate the price. I didn't try to get the best deal. I spoke to a sales rep. These are the numbers he threw out as special show pricing. I believe all included the honeycomb table but not rotary, delivery, or any tax that may be applicable.

A few months ago I got a price quote on a Rayjet 300 80W and it was in the mid 20's. This was a price quote via a quick phone call. Not show pricing. I was just getting a feel for pricing as I was thinking about buying a used piece of equipment and wanted an idea of how much the Rayjet series cost.

[David Somers]

I am curious. Is there a comprehensive listing of trade shows for lasers? I wondered about that the other day and thought Hmmmm. They could fall into so many categories of shows. Woodworking. Signs. Awards. Graphics. Plastics. Does anyone have a feel for the better shows to focus on?

[Scott Shepherd]

But you won't post what you paid....

I don't have the paper work available to me. It's on an old computer that has been retired from service and I don't think I need to take the time to set it all back up to pull of a 3 year old quote to post it when it's not relative to anything.

That, as well as I think it's poor form to post prices you paid for lasers. It ends up creating a lot of issues with the dealers and companies. If I negotiate a good price for my laser and you don't, then you'll pick up the phone, call the dealer and say "How come Steve got his laser for $2,000 less than I did" and then it's a race to the bottom for them.

I wouldn't want people publishing the pricing I give to my customers, so I've prefer not to post transactions I consider private on a public forum. I don't talk to Trotec about pricing because I'm not in the market for a laser. The only information I have is random conversations at trade shows like "what's that going for these days" or someone that's looking at one asking me if I think the price is decent.

[Ross Moshinsky]

I don't have the paper work available to me. It's on an old computer that has been retired from service and I don't think I need to take the time to set it all back up to pull of a 3 year old quote to post it when it's not relative to anything.

That, as well as I think it's poor form to post prices you paid for lasers. It ends up creating a lot of issues with the dealers and companies. If I negotiate a good price for my laser and you don't, then you'll pick up the phone, call the dealer and say "How come Steve got his laser for $2,000 less than I did" and then it's a race to the bottom for them.

I wouldn't want people publishing the pricing I give to my customers, so I've prefer not to post transactions I consider private on a public forum. I don't talk to Trotec about pricing because I'm not in the market for a laser. The only information I have is random conversations at trade shows like "what's that going for these days" or someone that's looking at one asking me if I think the price is decent.

You're helping them, not yourself. Go ask the car industry. Now they've completely changed and people are happy buying cars instead of feeling dreadful. The process has actually improved things for everyone through relative transparency.

[Mike Null]

Steve

I agree with you about posting price paid. I posted mine since it was 8 years old and not relevant to today's prices except to show that they are less now than then.

Mine was without any accessories.

If I were buying one today I wouldn't post the price.