Im mad... really mad, any input?

[John Shuk]

Call The Tool Nut. They sell Jet as well as Powermatic. WWW.toolnut.com

[Randal Stevenson]

I figured this thread would be the place to continue on my table saw odyssey.

I had decided to buy the Powermatic 2000. Heavy trunion, great reviews, etc etc.

Woodcraft also honored 10% off even though the sale was long over. This saw was a bit more expensive but I decided to go with the upgrade.

I was actually glad to make the change and looking forward to the PM.

The manager called Powermatic and asked if the model I wanted was in stock. Yes, its sitting right here in the warehouse. Good the manager says, we are ordering it.

Do they have ANY floor demo models that they could take the fence and rails off of?

[Fred Woodward]

You can probably get a set of PM rails for about $100 on that auction site. That's what I did when refurbing my PM66. Actually bought a set of 30" rails and later got a set of 50". It was about $125 for either set. Brand new rails and all the mounting hardware.

That does suck though about the Jet; I feel your pain.

[Pat Germain]

I'm pretty sure the Denver Rockler has PowerMatic table saws in stock. Are you anywhere near a Rockler store? That way you could do a laying on of hands and walk out the door with it.

I'm wondering what's going on with PowerMatic/Jet. Since they are under the same parent company, perhaps they're experiencing some serious labor pains trying to birth the latest reorg and offshoring efforts.

Considering the negative comments about fit and finish problems with PM, in addition to vaporware orders from both JET and PM, I think looking elsewhere would be the the best plan these days. We are fortunate to have lots of choices with woodworking machinery these days. Exploit it.

[Fred Voorhees]

Yes they are. It is an insanely nice saw for a good price. I wouldn't be surprised if it claims the top selling cabinet saw title.

Anyway, last I heard they still have 5HP models in stock, so you can probably switch your order and get it in a few days.

If you really want a SS, I doubt anything short of it would keep you satisfied, so you may just want to pony up and get one.


Eric

Eric, to be honest, when I was going to go the 5 HP route because of the delay, but when I checked the Rockler site (where I ordered my 3 HP Jet) the 5 HP was actually a longer wait than the 3 HP unit. I am hoping to have my delivery within two or three weeks. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

[Rick Gifford]

I sent the following to the WMH Toolgroup company:

I would like to voice my displeasure on troubles I have had trying to buy your products.

Beginning of February I purchased from Woodcraft of Parkersburg, WV the 10" Jet XACTA 50" 3HP tablesaw. I also ordered a dado insert and a coiple low profile riving knives. Deliver would be 2 to three weeks.

A month later, first of March, I asked about the delivery. Woodcraft called and was now told shippment was to be send May 28th. I wouldnt get my new tablesaw until June!

After considering the Grizzly's, ToolCity, Unisaws etc, I decided to cancel tis order and purchase a Powermatic 2000 10" tablesaw, 30" rails. It was $500 more but I felt it would be a great saw. So now I have waited for a bad order for nothing, and ended up spending more money to fix the problem.

Woodcraft called the distribution and asked if the PM2000 model I wanted was in stock and ready to go. Yes, its right here they said. It was ordered immediatey. I also ordered a dado insert and a couple riving knives.
Shipment would be one to two weeks.

Ok I said, so I sold my other tablesaw and have been without one in my shop for about 6 weeks by the time this one gets here. But it is what it is.

3 weeks later I asked about the delivery. Woodcraft called and was told it is backordered and shipment is now April 28th. But we asked and you said it was there ready to go the manager said. Uh yea, the saw is here, but the rails are backordered.

I have had enough. I cancelled this order as well.

I tried very hard to stick with Jet or Powermatic, I like the tools. I own a Jet mini lathe and a Jet 18" 3HP Bandsaw. Great tools.

As a woodworker I am extremely put off not having a tablesaw. I cant rely on getting one here.

Now I have to look for second best. I wanted you to know what has happened. I can't express my disappointment in the whole thing. I really wanted that PM 2000.

I stuck with Woodcraft because I like to support local retailers and I was getting 10% off my purchase. Free shipping to their store. A good deal for me. I will now be forced to pay more for a lesser saw.

On top of it I dont have a tablesaw in my shop. Thats what I get for trusting my order and selling my old tablesaw.

Thank you for listening to my complaint.
Rick Gifford
Vienna, WV

Ok maybe I relished a little on buying a lesser saw for more and all, but a little bragging on the products doesnt hurt.

This should pretty much end my ordeal on this route. I appreciate all the feedback. Thanks everyone.

Rick

[Curt Doles]

Great letter, calm and precise!
It will be interesting to see how/if they respond.

I had a similar beef with Ford on an Expedition I owned. The same module failed three times under warranty and a fourth just outside the warranty.

I thought they might cover part or all of the expense for the part that failed 4 times. The response I received from the "I hate my job" representitive was, the warranty has expired, what part don't you understand.

I've bought about eight cars since then, not one Ford.

Good Luck,
Curt

[Mike Heidrick]

I am thinking because your Woodcraft cannot work with a distributor/warehouse who can order and keep stock, you are now going to send a note to WMH and buy a saw you do not really want.

WMH does not care if you buy a saw from them or not or about your one Woodcraft dealer in WV who cannot seem to get a saw shipped to him.

Call some dealers that have the saw in stock. If you are getting a good deal on a Saw, others are too and you may have to wait a bit to get that deal. Otherwise pay the normal going rate and get your saw faster.

Myself and others have given you recomendations on where to find the saw you really want in stock. If you buy a saw you do not want it will eat at you all the time while you use it. In your mind you have to pass up the "1st place" saw because of the first dealer you choose. I think you need to pass up the 1st place dealer and not the 1st place saw.

[Mike Ryschkewitsch]

I just got a Woddcraft flyer with 10% off all Jet tools on April 12. If you want the Jet, I'd go in on April 12th and ask for the 10% off and cancel and re-order if necessary.

Mike R

[Steve Sawyer]

Oh, and don't forget to write an email to WMH letting them know how they blew it with their poor stocking situation.

Not to be the cynic here, but do you think they really care? My experience has shown that companies that provide poor service or who allow poor customer relationship experiences to occur, aren't unaware of their level of performance. They have made a calculated decision to be a particular kind of company, and what we see as customers or potential customers is the result.

It's apparent that demand for these two products (the Deluxe XACTA and perhaps the PM2000) has exceeded their projections, even in this crappy economy. My take on this particular situation is that someone in marketing has decided that to acknowledge this as a failure and to try to correct the problem even in some small way, would detract from the "premium product" cachet that a shortage of a product can imply. Note that the distributor I'm doing business with has been unable to get any kind of confirmation that the saw I am waiting for will indeed be supplied from the shipment WMH is expecting in late April. My concern is that this shipment may be oversold (they under estimated demand remember...) but my concerns and obviously those of many other disappointed customers aren't shared by the company.

Thus I won't waste any time trying to make the company aware of my dissatisfaction. I'd like to "punish" them by canceling my order, but a) my saw will just go to the next anxious customer in line and b) I really want this particular saw .

[Steve Sawyer]

I am thinking because your Woodcraft cannot work with a distributor/warehouse who can order and keep stock, you are now going to send a note to WMH and buy a saw you do not really want.

I don't think this issue lies with the distributors, Mike. There are several of us that are running into the same problem, and we're all doing business through different distributors. As to having product "in stock", I don't know of any distributors that can afford to stock table saws in any quantity. The distributor I'm working with is one of two major industrial machinery distributors that I know of in my area, and neither keeps this kind of product in stock. Consider that if they just wanted to stock the Jet line, they'd have to stock about 8 units just to cover all the optional configurations of the two 10" cabinet saws. That's a lot of money (and space!) tied up in one part of one product line. Then there are the jointers, planers, band saws, lathes etc. and if they sell multiple brands like Delta, PM, Jet, Steel City...well, you get the picture.

No, this situation is the fault of the manufacturer, and finding a distributor who has the exact saw that we're looking for in stock ready for delivery would be just a case of dumb luck.

[Raymond Fries]

I would not wait. There are many competitors that have excellent saws as well.

My $0.02 worth...

[Mike Gabbay]

Rick - Does the Woodcraft have either saw on their showroom floor? If so, they should sell it to you at a reduced priced given all of your hassles. Otherwise, look at the Generals. I looked long and hard at the General and the PM. Overall I liked the General far better. Even when I talked with the PM dealer, they just did not have a lot of great things to say about the saws now that they are made overseas. I'm waiting for mine to come in. So far it is looking like next week. I've already sold my saw so I'm in the same boat as you.

[Mike Heidrick]

Yeah I am wrong here then. Sorry I spoke up - not really my battle. Looks like this is just a HOT saw right now - actually both are HOT saws right now. I hope you boys get them soon. That new Jet Deluxe and the PM2000s are dream saws. Seriously, try amazon - They have shipped a large portion of my HUGE Delta tools to me all very QUICKLY. ABF and Eagle freightlines work well for amazon and liftgate is free if you ask for it.


I know you hate hearing about the sawstop too, but if you need one other crazy saw idea, you may be able to find one in stock. High price on these means they do not fly out of the showrooms as fast as the others. I waited two weeks to get a 5hp model but there was a 3hp in stock when I bought it and that was in a town of 100K peopel at a Woodcraft. Also everything is a la carte so there are not 8 options with this saw. Don't want their fence - buy a different one. Money is not the same though - hell you could buy a PM2000 and a Jet Deluxe and still save money. Anyway, Good luck boys.

BTW - Used the dado on the sawstop today and the switchover is very fast. Took the time to clean up the 10" WWII while it was off. Man it was due. Clean your blades up while waiting on your saws!

[Rick Gifford]

Mike Gabbay,

I havent seen the Generals but I plan to. Thanks for the input.

Mike Heidrick,

I promise you I wont buy a saw I dont really want. The second best comment is only for their benefit.

I hope you are wrong that WMH doesnt care if I buy a saw from them then their business is in trouble. Stop caring about the customers and they'll stop caring about you. But honestly I didnt write them for them to fix my issues. I think they would appreciate knowing any troubles so it wont happen again to someone else. Some companies do, some don't.