Do you really have a guard on your table saw?

[Don Stutsman]

I wish I could say 'yes' but alas, it is in a drawer somewhere. I know that is a bad thing but the darn thing never worked well and always seemed in the way. I am; however, very cautious around the saw.

[Nissim Avrahami]

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For final statement, almost everyone's comments echoed the opinion that they would likely used guards and splitters if they were quick to remove, so why don't the saw makers provide one?
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Al

I think that the Splitter/guard looks like that because of the OSHA requirements...

The law requires the makers to equip the table saw (Hand-fed circular rip saw - as it's called by OSHA) with a Splitter (Spreader - as per OSHA) but, OSHA also demands the Anti-kickback pawls (Nonkickback fingers) that "Shall be designed to provide adequate holding power for all the thicknesses of materials being cut"
That means that the splitter must extend above the blade level to accommodate the Pawls hinge and it must be removed for non-through cuts.

The Guard (Hood)..."will automatically adjust itself to the thickness of and remain in contact with the material being cut"... so, it's a little bit complicated to remove it and that's the reason that most of the people just remove both of them (guard/splitter) forever...

The European law does not require the guard to "remain in contact with the material being cut" so it can move up/down with the riving knife.

Anti-kickback pawl are not required, so the Riving knife can sit just below the blade level and never interfere with non-through cuts.

The EU law also demands from the makers to make the guard removal/installation very easy (no tools) and quick, to encourage people to use it.

At the pic below you can see my TS that is typical EU...to install the guard, it's a matter of "click" and turn the wing nut...

The EU safety regulation makers are "pressed" all the times by the "Unions" that wants safer working environment for their members and the result is that also the amateurs like me are getting safer machines.

A "brand new" law is, from yesterday (1.1.2008), all the rotating machines with removable guards that are used for Woodworking and Metalworking, must stop rotation within 10 seconds or less...they discovered that many accidents happened during the long "run-down" of the cutter...my TS already complies with this law...

Regards
niki
Riving knife.jpg

[Andrew Williams]

Even with a Sawstop I use the guard on every cut except when not possible. For those other cuts I use the riving knife.

Expediency does not trump safety in the case of tools which have the potential to create permanent damage to our precious hands.

[Tim Marks]

There was a plywood box that clamped onto the table for ripping thin strips – it completely covered the blade and had featherboards built in.

John, would you mind describing this a bit more. Did it only cover the left hand side of the blade to allow the fence to get closer to the blade?

I use a bladeguard as much as possible, but when cutting thin strips it sometimes gets in the way, and I would be interested in what other options might exist.

My new-years resolution? Use the benchdog push stick below, instead of using whatever stick was handy (or none if it wasn't).

[Rod Sheridan]

30 years of using a tablesaw, and I always use a guard.

My present saw (General 650) has an Excalibur overarm guard and Merlin splitter.

The overarm guard allows all operations except for tenon jig use.

I made a box guard for the tenoning jig out of 6mm birch plywood that covered the blade except for the opening where the workpiece was inserted. It worked great, however I now cut the tenons on the shaper in one pass using a stacked cutter. (With a guard of course).

When I was working in the wood industry, all machinery had guards, without exception, and most machines had metal guards. There wasn't any need to see the blade cutting the wood, and metal provided more protection from a flying knot or cutter than a piece of plexiglass.

My favourite machine to setup was the 40 HP gang rip saw, it could convert 12/4 oak into strips faster than two men could feed it. Watching the ammeter climb into the 30 + HP range during cutting, and listening to the occasional explosion of a piece with a knot, I was very happy to have replaced the heavy steel and chain mesh guards on the machine after setup.


I guess I've carried that safety focus into my hobby as well.

My Father-in-law is a retired cabinet maker, and he has many stories of experts who sawed, jointed or shaped their fingers by operating machinery without guards/splitters/jigs because they were in a hurry, or didn't want to build a guard or jig for the particular job.

He doesn't have any stories of people who mutilated themselves on machinery that was properly guarded however.

Regards, Rod.

P.S. I ride a motorcycle as basic personal transport for 8 months per year, always with a full helmet, full riding suit with armour, and gloves and boots. I've only needed all that gear once, however the bike and my protective clothing were destroyed in an accident, and I walked away with a lot of bruises, and a great deal of respect for body armour and riding suits with Kevlar material in them.

I didn't need the above experiment, however using the safety gear worked much better than riding while wearing a T shirt and shorts.

Something to think about the next time you operate your saw without a guard, make sure you leave instructions posted as to how to retrieve your fingers from the dust collector in case the emergency medical personnel aren't familiar with woodworking machinery.

[Bruce Benjamin]

30 years of using a tablesaw, and I always use a guard.

My present saw (General 650) has an Excalibur overarm guard and Merlin splitter.

The overarm guard allows all operations except for tenon jig use.

I made a box guard for the tenoning jig out of 6mm birch plywood that covered the blade except for the opening where the workpiece was inserted. It worked great, however I now cut the tenons on the shaper in one pass using a stacked cutter. (With a guard of course).

When I was working in the wood industry, all machinery had guards, without exception, and most machines had metal guards. There wasn't any need to see the blade cutting the wood, and metal provided more protection from a flying knot or cutter than a piece of plexiglass.

My favourite machine to setup was the 40 HP gang rip saw, it could convert 12/4 oak into strips faster than two men could feed it. Watching the ammeter climb into the 30 + HP range during cutting, and listening to the occasional explosion of a piece with a knot, I was very happy to have replaced the heavy steel and chain mesh guards on the machine after setup.


I guess I've carried that safety focus into my hobby as well.

My Father-in-law is a retired cabinet maker, and he has many stories of experts who sawed, jointed or shaped their fingers by operating machinery without guards/splitters/jigs because they were in a hurry, or didn't want to build a guard or jig for the particular job.

He doesn't have any stories of people who mutilated themselves on machinery that was properly guarded however.

Regards, Rod.

P.S. I ride a motorcycle as basic personal transport for 8 months per year, always with a full helmet, full riding suit with armour, and gloves and boots. I've only needed all that gear once, however the bike and my protective clothing were destroyed in an accident, and I walked away with a lot of bruises, and a great deal of respect for body armour and riding suits with Kevlar material in them.

I didn't need the above experiment, however using the safety gear worked much better than riding while wearing a T shirt and shorts.

Something to think about the next time you operate your saw without a guard, make sure you leave instructions posted as to how to retrieve your fingers from the dust collector in case the emergency medical personnel aren't familiar with woodworking machinery.

Yeah, yeah, right Rod. That's all well and good for you but you forget that there are some people on this forum who are experts with their equipment and don't need the guards because they pay extra close attention and use push sticks. They can't possibly hurt themselves if they pay close attention now can they? All of those other guys who have lost fingers or worse just weren't experienced enough and weren't paying close attention, right?

Actually, great post and well said from what sounds like a voice of experience and wisdom. I decided that I guess I really don't care if the more experienced guys who don't use a guard get mutilated or whatever happens to them. They know the different arguments and choose to ignore what is obvious to others. But I appreciate posts like yours because hopefully there are some newbies reading this and choose to operate their equipment with the proper safety devices instead of using it in a more careless manner.

Bruce

[Denny Rice]

When I bought my new tablesaw a couple of yrs ago, I thought since I was getting older maybe I needed to try to use the guard. Soon after installing it I learned "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" I felt like it made my tablesaw more combersome and harder to get the job done. I soon removed it and put it back in the box. I've been doing this as a hobby since the early 80's and cannot get use to a guard. Sorry guys. My sawblade is never set any higher than 1/8 of an inch higher than the stock I am cutting.

[Al Willits]

Goes to show you anybody can rationize just about anything.

Like said, thank goodness it never happens to them that know what they're doing...uh huh....your choice, your fingers.

Just wondering, if your only a 1/8" above the work and your cutting a 2" board, doesn't that leave a 2 1/8" blade sticking up?

What ever works for ya I guess.

Al

[Rod Sheridan]

Yeah, yeah, right Rod. That's all well and good for you but you forget that there are some people on this forum who are experts with their equipment and don't need the guards because they pay extra close attention and use push sticks. They can't possibly hurt themselves if they pay close attention now can they? All of those other guys who have lost fingers or worse just weren't experienced enough and weren't paying close attention, right?

Actually, great post and well said from what sounds like a voice of experience and wisdom. I decided that I guess I really don't care if the more experienced guys who don't use a guard get mutilated or whatever happens to them. They know the different arguments and choose to ignore what is obvious to others. But I appreciate posts like yours because hopefully there are some newbies reading this and choose to operate their equipment with the proper safety devices instead of using it in a more careless manner.

Bruce

Hi Bruce, yes people will rationalize all sorts of behaviour to avoid learning new ways of doing things.

In Canada we have universal health care, so the monetary cost of cutting off a finger could be lower than in America, however it's still far higher than even the most expensive guards available.

Although it's obvious, you don't need a guard for the 99.999% of the time you're paying attention, it's for the other 0.001% of the time.

I had one of those moments a few years ago when I squaring, then cutting to length some stiles for a cabinet door.

I was doing the square, flip, drop the flip stop down, cut to length routine. Yes routine, the most dangerous time at a machine.

I was flipping the stile and almost dropped it, which made me grab it with my right hand. Well almost grab it, I punched the overarm guard.

If the guard hadn't been there, my hand would been in the blade.

I shut off the saw, went upstairs for a mug of tea to settle my nerves.

It had been a nasty accident prevented by spending $400 on a guard, and using it every time.

Regards, Rod.

[Bruce Benjamin]

Hi Bruce, yes people will rationalize all sorts of behaviour to avoid learning new ways of doing things.

In Canada we have universal health care, so the monetary cost of cutting off a finger could be lower than in America, however it's still far higher than even the most expensive guards available.

Although it's obvious, you don't need a guard for the 99.999% of the time you're paying attention, it's for the other 0.001% of the time.

I had one of those moments a few years ago when I squaring, then cutting to length some stiles for a cabinet door.

I was doing the square, flip, drop the flip stop down, cut to length routine. Yes routine, the most dangerous time at a machine.

I was flipping the stile and almost dropped it, which made me grab it with my right hand. Well almost grab it, I punched the overarm guard.

If the guard hadn't been there, my hand would been in the blade.

I shut off the saw, went upstairs for a mug of tea to settle my nerves.

It had been a nasty accident prevented by spending $400 on a guard, and using it every time.

Regards, Rod.

I can see why it would mean something to some people but to me the cost of cutting off a finger(s) or a hand isn't really an issue. Yes, it would be better if after cutting off something I didn't have to deal with the bills but to me that's the least of my worries. Perhaps I'd feel different if it were to actually happen though. Hopefully I'll never find out.

Your near-miss example is an excellent one. Even with events other than woodworking this sort of automatic reaction happens. I have a collection of very sharp, high quality professional knives in my kitchen from when I was a chef years ago. If I happen to accidentally knock a glass off of the counter my initial response is to keep it from hitting the floor with full impact by sticking my foot underneath it to slow the fall. If I drop a heavy can I do this to keep from denting the floor. But If I accidentally bump or push one of my knives off of the counter I have to resist that automatic foot response and jump back. My normal response has been to clear a path to the floor for the knife. But sometimes things happen so fast and signals get crossed in the ol' brain. I'd rather stab the floor and possibly damage a blade than stab my foot. This isn't a common occurrence but it's happened a number of times over the years.

A few months ago I moved my cutting board and off goes my 10" razor sharp Henckels chef's knife. Not thinking, I stuck my foot under the blade to, "Cushion" the fall. As I was doing it I realized it was stupid but it happened so fast I couldn't stop myself. Fortunately the blade landed flat on top of my shoe and there was no harm done. But I sure felt stupid and my 9 year old son's eyes sure were wide.

I have pretty quick reflexes with my hands too and I usually catch something mid-air before it ever hits the floor. It's just a natural reflex. I've done this a few times with a knife too but for some reason I've been lucky and never cut myself. I need to work on suppressing that natural reflex I have to keep sharp things from falling to the floor. I've yet to grab anything falling near my TS though but if I do I'm smart enough to keep the blade guard in place.

I'm very experienced with knives in a professional and home environment. There are safety devices such as special cut resistant gloves that could be worn but they get in the way and really aren't practical for a fast paced kitchen environment. You could say the same thing about TS guards. There's a big difference between the two safety devices though. With a table saw we all know the very real potential for finger or hand amputation and possibly worse. But I've cut myself with a knife dozens of times and I've never required more than a bandage and some duct tape or even Crazy Glue. I've seen a few cuts that required a few stitches but there was practically no chance of an amputation or even bleeding to death. The cost of a mistake with a knife is a small amount of pain, some very annoying inconvenience, and another cool scar. We all know what the cost of a mistake on an unguarded table saw can be.

Bruce

[John Gornall]

Answer for Tim Marks:

The plywood box was a bridge over the fence. There were base plates flat on the table on each side of the fence - C-clamps held both base plates to the table. The fence, about 1.5 inches high, could move under this bridge box but an inch right of the blade was max - to the left of the blade was room for a board about 12 inches wide. On the front of the bridge was a plywood drop gate which could be adjusted according to the thickness of the board being cut. In the top and left side of the box were adjustable feather boards. It seems complicated but was actually quite simple. We had a customer that regularly ordered thousands of feet of strips of yellow cedar and walnut - we would rip all day long. I could push a board into the saw and when it got close to the box I would just push it through with the next board. On the outfeed the strip and the board would slide and drop into a hopper. After 100 boards or so I would go to the back of the saw, sort the finished strips, and take the boards fo the next cuts. The same customer would also order 1 x 2 pieces with a rabbet which we also cut with this safety box.

[Nate Folco]

When the cut allows for it, the guard is on. It's even the crappy OEM guard that came with my unisaw. I modified it a little bit by grinding a little channel so it stays up if needed. I also ground off part of the back to make a U rather than an O so I don't have to unscrew the back screw all the way to put it on and off. I also added a 4" dust collection port to the top.

May I'm just too inexperienced, but it has already prevented a possible injury.

[Eric Haycraft]

Short answer..
Splitter - yes
Guard - no

Experience - beginner
Time in ship/week - 8 hours

I use the VA pusher and MK Splitter whenever I can. Ever since I went to zero clearance inserts, the blade guard has been sitting in a box.

Personally, when I used the guard, it was usually in the way. I was typically cutting thinner strips and the guard made it nearly impossible to push the wood through. I almost wish that we had nice thin guards like the european one shown earlier in this thread. I would be much more inclined to use then because it wouldn't get in the way. I don't need to see the blade, but I need room for push sticks and such.

I have a dewalt table saw, have had it less than a year, and it is a PITA to get the guard on and off and it never seemed to line up correctly. I finally got fed up and found the MK splitter as an alternative and it would allow me to use zero clearance inserts easily. Had I known more when I was shopping for a saw, I would have gone with the sawstop or waited for more riving knife models to become available.

I do plan on getting an overhead dust extractor/guard, but for now I run the saw with just a splitter. I do realize that I am living dangerously right now, but am quite aware of the risks and try to avoid repetitive hypnosis by taking breaks and consciously thinking about every move both hands make when the blade is turning. Featherboards are always in place and I keep myself and my dog clear of the rear of the workpiece whenever possible.

[Dennis Peacock]

Nope...don't have one and haven't had one in the past 10 years of active woodworking.

[John Thompson]

When the cut allows for it, the guard is on. It's even the crappy OEM guard that came with my unisaw. I modified it a little bit by grinding a little channel so it stays up if needed. I also ground off part of the back to make a U rather than an O so I don't have to unscrew the back screw all the way to put it on and off. I also added a 4" dust collection port to the top.

May I'm just too inexperienced, but it has already prevented a possible injury.

If I may make a suggestion in regard to that back screw you refer too on your Uni-saw. I have no clue why a designeer would put a 5/16 screw that long on that position. As you know.. it take about 20 turns or more to unscrew it if you use a rachet. If you use and open end, it takes forever.

Suggestion.. get a 5/16" shorter hex bolt about 1 1/4" max lenght or better yet... get a 5/16" with T or Star handle attached. It then comes off with about 4 quick turns of that Star handle under 6 seconds.

Same senario on the front with the exception that the keeper bolt is attached and it has a Hex nut that is extremely difficult to get a wrench on with space alloted. Get a T handle ( I believe that one is 3/8") with receptive co-responding female threads and eliminate the Hex bolt. You will have to cut some of the length of the handle diameter to allow room to turn. But.. with two quick turns it will release tension so the splitter can be lifted off quickly.

Regards...

Sarge..

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