Ordering three new machines... need help on one.

[Burt Alcantara]

I went from a G0555 to a G0514X2. I cut logs. With the 14" I got a lot of deflection. Sometimes, with heavy logs, the saw would almost tilt over. The the 514, I cut the logs with a 1" Lennox blade that cuts like butter. The table is large, the saw is heavy. Don't have a single problem. Bearings are far better as is dust collection. If I had the room in the shop, I would have kept the 14" saw for more delicate work and avoiding having to change blades. The 514 can take 1/8" blades. The 0555 can take 1/16" blades.

G0514X2 -- highly recommended

[Norman Hitt]

I'm sure NOT one to tell you how to decide what SIZE to buy, seeing as how 7 years ago I had accompanied my wife to Austin. Tx for a meeting she had there and it was my 65 th Birthday. I had most of the day to kill by myself, so I thought I would go to Woodcraft and maybe buy myself some little present. Well, I bought a few small items but didn't really see much that I needed at the moment OR that really turned me on so I left with lots of time left to kill. I suddenly remembered that MiniMax was located close by and I had been wanting to see the MM 16 in person, soooooo... about a mile or so later I walked in and said I want to SEE a MM 16, do you have one? The nice lady said, we sure do and I'll get someone to take you back there.

Sheesh, what a candy store. I'm sure they had to wipe down the drool off of every tool they had there, (but they were nice and didn't complain). I'm sure they could sense that after that tour my resistance was probably at an all time LOW and they just needed to let me wander around and drool a little more until I talked myself into something).

They sure had me pegged right, 'cause shortly afterward, I walked out to go pick up my wife for lunch with a BIG GRIN on my face while I concocted up a really cool reply for when she would ask, "so what did you do this morning". I decided I would very casually say, Oh I bought myself a couple of little birthday presents. When she asked what I got, I would show her the $5 ea (on sale) router bits, four bags of "T" nuts and THEN the "sales ticket" for the "MM 20" Bandsaw and 1" Trimaster Blade. (in hindsight, I should have got the MM 24 while I still had the money to afford it), but then I probably couldn't have got the FS-350 and Mortiser attachment that she suggested I get, when we went to pick up the Bandsaw. Like I said, you don't Really want ME to tell you what size to buy, do you?

Oh yes, her response to my Cool Morning Report was; a big laugh and then, "Well, since you had the most fun this morning, I guess YOU get to buy Dinner tonight and I pick the Restaurant. Note; (She did NOT pick Mc Donalds for dinner)

Have Fun Shopping.

[Michael Schneider]

Kerry,

I understand time is money for some, and ordering a new item is predictable and painless.

I picked up an old delta 10" bandsaw for scrolling.

It is very beefy and built like there 14", but scaled down. I am still building a stand for it.

Have you thought about something like that? I don't know if anyone still builds a nice beefy 10" saw today. Does anyone know of a current model like the old delta 10" band saw?

This one is decades old.

http://www.owwm.com/photoindex/detail.aspx?id=163

Good luck,
Mike

[Kerry Kling]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I figure today is the day I make up my mind and just order something... right.

At this point in time I'm settled on the larger Grizzly 514X2 bandsaw and the G0604ZX 6" joiner.

I'm still tormented on the tablesaw. In one post Cary Falk suggested the 1023RL. I skimmed right past that saw because I thought it didn't have a riving blade... it does. With a quick release toggle no less. It also has a different trunnion system which seems to resemble the PM2000's design. So now that saw is in the mix along with the 0690 and the PM2000. I'm reading reviews on the two Grizzly options all over this morning which can be a mistake... as all I see are the horror stories... warped tables, shimming, vibration, inserts that don't lay flat, excessive rust etc. About all I can find bad on the PM is that you may not like the color of metallic mustard.

My gut says PM2000, my wallet says 1023RL and get a new two stage cyclone dust collection system with the difference.

[Cary Falk]

The 1023RL also has a blade shroud. I have one and am quite happy with it. I did have an non-flat insert (they sent me a ZCI for my troubles) but none of the other stuff you mention. I did a review on the Creek of it back in August or September.

[Joe Leigh]

Here's the review that convinced me on the Powermatic PM 2000 along with the great things many here had to say
The owner of this site is a fellow Creeker.
Scroll down and check out the video at the end.


http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/pm2000rvu.html

[Van Huskey]

I admit the PM2000 is a good bit more money but that was my choice and I would do it again. It has been a pleasure to use.

[Kerry Kling]

Here's the review that convinced me on the Powermatic PM 2000 along with the great things many here had to say
The owner of this site is a fellow Creeker.
Scroll down and check out the video at the end.


http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/pm2000rvu.html

Your post is perfect timing. Right after my last post this morning I ordered the PM2000. Found a great deal from ToolZone... free shipping with lift gate. So... table saw out of the way.

After I ordered the saw I turned my attention back to Grizzly. I called to check stock on the 514X2... it's back ordered. Should have ordered it last week. Oh well, snooze you lose. Pretty much thinking thats the one I want so I'll put that off for a bit.

Still going with the joiner and since the bandsaw won't happen for a while I'm thinking about a dust collection system. The one I had for the past thirty years was a broom and dust pan. I figure its time. Does anyone have experience with the new Grizzly G0703 dual stage cyclone? Suppose to be really quiet. I need something for the two table saws, joiner, planer. Not at the same time of course, maybe just one or two small portable (G1163's) and wheel them a round for each task?

Moving right along...

[Van Huskey]

Does anyone have experience with the new Grizzly G0703 dual stage cyclone? Suppose to be really quiet. I need something for the two table saws, joiner, planer. Not at the same time of course, maybe just one or two small portable (G1163's) and wheel them a round for each task?

Moving right along...

Ask in a separate post over in the Workshop forum and you should get plenty of opinions on that and other cyclones.

[Paul McGaha]

Congratulations Kerry.

Sounds like you are going to have some new toys soon.

PHM

[Paul Johnstone]

I'm hearin' ya loud and clear. Value wise doesn't make sense not to get the bigger 514X2. I'm just not seeing the need, though I may grow into it and find other uses. How do these bigger saws handle smaller blades for doing scroll work and curves?... seeing that they are used mostly for resawing. Any issues with tracking a narrow blade on a big wheel?

I have a Rikon 18" Bandsaw (great saw, BTW) Using a Carter Stablizer really helps on 1/4" blades when making scrolling cuts. You have to take off the upper bearings and swap it, but that's quick and painless. I have not tried smaller blades on the Stabilizer, but I believe other people have. I am not sure if they make a Carter Stabilizer for Griz BS or not.
If you are doing primarily scroll work on a larger BS, I would definitely get the Carter.

[Kerry Kling]

Bandsaw revisited...

So after a couple of days of getting the tablesaw and joiner purchases out of the way... and out of my head, I've been able to refocus on the bandsaw. I think there was a reason the 514X2 was backordered on me... I don't need it. Simply put, anything bigger than a 14" is overkill for my needs. I kept climbing the ladder of size and features because of price points. Clearly that way of thinking makes sense if you resaw. This will be a one trick pony though and in my case less is more. It will be in the corner setup to walk over to and carve out scrolls and curves out of 3/4" material for cabinet bottoms, legs etc. It will also be on wheels to move out as I need it, and back again out of the way... resawing maybe on a rare occasion.

So all this narrows things down to two saws...
The Grizzly 0457
Powermatic

Both priced about the same, and where I want to be, so Laguna is out. One is steel frame, the other cast iron. Both weigh about the same. Table heights are 42" compared to 37" on the bigger saws... better height for smaller detailed work. Powermatic comes with free riser, light, dust blower (don't know if any of this matters). Powermatic seems to have a better guide setup...? I think there is a free shipping lift gate offer as well with some dealers. PM seems a little more stout...?

Again... it will be a one task saw. Maybe just go with a color preference? If I go with the Grizzly it will match the new joiner. The Powermatic will match the new saw..LOL.

[Cary Falk]

I have the G0513X2 and I would never go back to a cast iron BS with a riser block. I don't think I would pay that much for a 14" BS. If those were my choices I think I would go with C) a G0555 before the PM. If you don't really need it I would wait it out. The G051x series saws are nice saws.

[Van Huskey]

I like the PM as it is very full featured and the G0457 is a nice saw as well but loses to the Rikon especially when the Rikon 14" deluxe is on sale. In any event the PM will run you right at 1K shipped and the G0457 about 1035 liftgate shipped. The steel spined saws are not really an issue unless you plan to resaw, the cast clones are great for contour cutting. If you don't really want all the bells and whistles of the PM the Grizzly G555P is about $540 liftgate shipped and would probably serve you fine and you could add some of the options of the PM and still be well below it in price.

1. If you really want a steel spined saw look at the Rikon (will be onsale at Woodcraft the 8th but not as cheap as it goes on sale about 3 times a year, think it will be about $770 but the bigger sales get it down to 699, but that will probably be 2-3 months)
2. If you really want the bells and whistles look at the PM (free liftgate delivery will be at most dealers)
3. If you want a basic saw to do the jobs you mention get the G555 or G555P and save several hundred bucks
4. If you want to save money but stay in the WMH family and have a 5 year warranty consider one of the 14" Jets (also with free liftgate)

[Kerry Kling]

Still tormented on the bandsaw choice. Now back considering the 513X2 over the 0457. I'm not concerned with the prices, just want to get the right size saw. The lower priced Grizzlies just don't appeal to me, so they're out.

The 17" offers more... better resawing abilities down the road, larger work table in case I have a need for scrolling something bigger. The 0457 has a more comfortable working height which is a big deal with my bad back. I could always put the 513 on a riser though.

Below is a pic of the parts I carve out, sometimes a couple dozen at a clip... with a jig saw! Its a pain in the a$$.

Cary, have you used your 513X2 with smaller blades for scroll work...

#1) Do the 1/4" & 3/8" blades track well on the bigger saw compared to a 14"...?
#2) Which would be the right size blade...?

Thanks again guys for the help.