under $2k J/P Showdown: Grizzly vs Jet

[Matt Lentzner]

Guys,

I am pretty sure I will be buying a 12" J/P combo machine sometime in the next 12-24 months. (I'm not an impulse shopper by any stretch - besides both machines are back ordered). The under $2k price point is very attractive and makes getting separates (13" lunchbox, 8" jointer) with less capacity for ~$500 less pretty unattractive from both a space and money perspective. (I assume I'd want to upgrade them at some point, why not go for broke?)

The other advantage is that I could upgrade to a Byrd head at a later date for $1100 (I got a quote from Byrd Tools) - which is a lot of money, but I would be getting a helical head on two machines at one shot. $550 for a 12" Shelix jointer head and another $550 for a 12" Shelix planer head doesn't sound so bad. Just so I have something to look forward to .

I had my heart set on the Grizzly G0633, but I just recently found out about the Jet 708475. I wanted to compare them side by side and discuss the pluses and minuses of each unit. I have no experience with machines of this type so I hoping some of you who own/used one can comment.

Tale of the tape: (Where they differ)

Price (delivered)
Grizz: $1943
Jet: $1799 (ToolKing.com)

Jointer Table Length
Grizz: 59-7/8"
Jet: 55"

Guard
Grizz: Porkchop
Jet: Euro Bridge

Motor
Grizz: 5hp
Jet: 3hp

Weight
Grizz: 672 lbs.
Jet: 525 lbs.

My comments:

There's no question the Grizzly is the more substantial machine. It is considerably heavier and has the larger motor and 5" longer jointer table. The extra $145 or so doesn't seem like a lot to pay for this. The guard is familiar to me although that doesn't mean I wouldn't like the Jet Euro-style guard.

On the other hand, I find the choice of a 5hp motor somewhat curious. It seems like overkill. Even Grizzly's 12" jointer and 15" planer use a 3hp motor. It could be a pain if your wiring isn't 10 gauge already. Having to run new line to feed this machine could make the price effectively much more depending on your options available to make electrical changes.

My master plan is to have a 12" shop (jointing, planing, resawing) running on 3hp motors. The Grizz would be an oddball and take away some flexibility as far as moving machines around and plugging them in at different places.

So I'm leaning toward the Jet, but I will be waiting for the reviews, both in publication and here before I make my final decision. Of course I will buy what I feel is the best machine, the concerns about the Grizzly only rate consideration as a tie-breaker.

Thanks for your time,

Matt

[Jamie Buxton]

You should publish where you live, and ask if anybody on this forum has one of these machines near you. I'd bet they'd be willing to show it off to you , and even make a little sawdust. Nothing beats a live demo.


..or, considering the brand-new status of these machines, you might wait until you're really ready to buy. There might be more machines out there then...

[Paul Johnstone]

Guys,

I am pretty sure I will be buying a 12" J/P combo machine sometime in the next 12-24 months. (I'm not an impulse shopper by any stretch - besides both machines are back ordered). The under $2k price point is very attractive and makes getting separates (13" lunchbox, 8" jointer) with less capacity for ~$500 less pretty unattractive from both a space and money perspective. (I assume I'd want to upgrade them at some point, why not go for broke?)

Keep in mind that the shorter tables on a combo machine might be a disadvantage.. It depends on what you do. I remember attempting to join 7' long 2" thick oak on a 6" jointer with short beds.. basically impossible. Sure, in theory, you can rig outfeed rollers, etc for extra support, but in reality it's not accurate enough (and I'm not one of those guys that's overly anal retentive.. I tried, and got better results by planing only).

My master plan is to have a 12" shop (jointing, planing, resawing) running on 3hp motors.

Are combo machines able to be moved around on mobile bases? I don't know how heavy they are. That's another factor.. Ideally, since a BS doesn't take up that much space it's nice to push it against a wall and leave it there.

[JayStPeter]

With the Grizzly, you can go directly to the shelix for $2400.

I'm considering the upgrade myself, but it'll probably be a couple years. But, I'll be watching the reviews of these machines.

Jay

[Curt Harms]

I think with the Jet You don't have to remove the fence like with the Grizzlyto switch functions. Also, the Jet beds move together rather than separately and have spring assist to raise them. I believe the Jet has corrugated cast iron beds. Their point is that stock slides easier on corrugated beds than on solid CI beds. That may be true, but how about edge jointing thin stock? I suspect 3 h.p. is plenty in a non-production setting and should work with a 20 amp. 240 volt service. I think a 5 h.p. would require a 30 amp. service. Wait a few years and segmented spiral cutter heads may become more available. I'm having the same thoughts about a combo machine. There's a review & video available at Tom Hintz' site:http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/jetjjp12rvu.html

HTH

Curt

[Kevin Murdock]

Matt,

Take note that the Grizzly J/P machines are 12" jointer and 11-3/4" planer.

The planer table is not wide enough to handle 12" stock. This is accurately reflected in the user manual on the Grizzly site, at the top of page 4, so they are aware of this and I did PM Shiraz about it as well. Oddly, the 12" capability is still claimed on the specification sheet as it was posted well in advance of the machine's arrival date.

I own the machine (G0634), and can confirm the reduced capability. Other than that, it is a really nice machine.

If that ability to plane a full 12" is needed, that could affect your choice.

Hope this helps,
-Kevin

[David Axmann]

I have the Grizzly with spiral head on order. It is backordered until May 2008. I also have some feelers out to a few Jet dealers regarding Jet's combo machine.

One thing I am not familiar with is how the Euro Bridge style guard works. I've never used a machine with one. From Tom's video I see the guard is set to the exact height for face jointing and the exact distance for edge jointing. Does the guard not automatically 'close' after a pass? If I am edge jointing 6/4 stock does that mean after my pass that much room is still open to the exposed cutterhead? Same for the height; does the guard remain off the table after a face jointing pass?

If so I don't see how that could be any safer or better. Either way it wouldn't be a deal maker or breaker, I'm just curious.

[Jim Becker]

David, the bridge guard works as you state. For face jointing, it's raised to just clear the material but completely covers the cutter head. For edge jointing, it's pulled away from the fence, but left at table height. Only the small gap where the board goes through remains uncovered. (It does not close automatically like the porkchop) And having used the Euro bridge guard on my own J/P now for several years...you couldn't get me to go back to a porkchop for any conceivable bribe. Much better system and IMHO, safer since there is no exposure when face jointing and extremely limited exposure well away from the hands when doing edges. That's why it's required in Europe.

I've been thinking about doing a short video to demonstrate the bridge guard at some point...when I have the time.

[Chris Padilla]

I'm with Jim on this...I switched over to the Euro guard on my 16" MM J/P...that pork chop cover is just a pain on such a wide table surface.

[Matt Lentzner]

With the Grizzly, you can go directly to the shelix for $2400.

I'm considering the upgrade myself, but it'll probably be a couple years. But, I'll be watching the reviews of these machines.

Jay

That's not the Byrd Shelix head for $2400. It's the Grizzly spiral head. Maybe I've just succumbed to marketing hype, but I'd rather have a real Shelix head. It has shearing action while the Grizzly does not. Does this make a difference in practice? I don't know, but my normal reaction is to go with the best available.

Matt

[David Weaver]

>>the best available<<

http://www.northfieldwoodworking.com...CutterHead.pdf

!!!!!

Warning to anyone who likes tools - you could have some serious jonesing problems if you have a fast connection and look at that link.

Kidding aside, I am looking forward to seeing some reviews of these machines from actual users. One of them is in my future - probably toward the end of 2008, or maybe later if it takes a while for the manufacturers to catch up with demands. Such a thing in my two car garage (which still has two cars in it, too) on wheels would be very useful.

[Rob Wright]

Like a lot of people - I have been eying both of these since they were announced. Having only seen them on the web - I am leaning towards to Jet simply from the ease of change over standpoint. Watch the below link - both the Jet and the Grizzly are shown being converted from Planer to Joiner. I have other Grizzly tools and I am very pleased with them, but I am looking forward to seeing the Jet in the local showroom. The 5hp may be overkill in my mind as well for the Grizz.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRowR...eature=related

- Rob

[Chris Padilla]

That's not the Byrd Shelix head for $2400. It's the Grizzly spiral head. Maybe I've just succumbed to marketing hype, but I'd rather have a real Shelix head. It has shearing action while the Grizzly does not. Does this make a difference in practice? I don't know, but my normal reaction is to go with the best available.

Matt

Matt,

That is not quite correct. Both have a shearing action but the Byrd kind of "doubles up" on it by pointing the individual cutters in a shearing angle whereas the Griz has the cutters head-on. However, both have the cutters in a shearing angle as they line up along the cylinder, slightly stepped back from each other.

I hope this makes sense...kinda hard to explain...pics are worth a 1000 words and I know I've seen them out there on the good old 'net.

[David Axmann]

My unfamiliarity with the euro style guards makes it hard to visualize its operation in different situations. I'd like to take a closer look at the Jet if I could find a dealer nearby that had one in stock.

[David Weaver]

My unfamiliarity with the euro style guards makes it hard to visualize its operation in different situations. I'd like to take a closer look at the Jet if I could find a dealer nearby that had one in stock.

Can someone clarify how this works for those of us who are in the uninitiated group? Does the Euro guard put pressure across the board over the cutterhead? If so, that would be a nice feature, even if it does interfere with hand-feeding the boards.

The couple of times I've used larger jointers with the pork chop (or with no guard at all), I've worried about whether or not I can get evne pressure, and the easy solution to that is obvious - power feed. Not something i'm likely to get in my shop.